Liverpool FC Forum

by **Ghost of Shankly** » Tue Mar 20, 2018 5:36 pm

With Jurgen Klopp trying to build something decent at Anfield, after the departure of Coutinho Mid-Season, I'm struggling to see how Jurgen will be able to build a team good enough to challenge for the top honours over the coming seasons.

Coutinho is gone, so we have a light midfield, and a void to fill. Mo Salah has really excelled this season, and although he will still be here next season, at the end of next season if he continues to play well consistently, inevitably. big bids 150m+ will emerge from Real Madrid and Barcelona etc. The same goes for Keita next season. If he puts on a red shirt and becomes a world beater for us, we'll struggle to hold onto him also.

We are a selling club. How can Jurgen Klopp build anything decent if our top players dissappear to Europes elite clubs if they show any decent form?

It's a constant re-building process, and I think our manager will struggle to build a title winning squad. Maybe a solution is to offer them lucrative contracts, high wages etc.

Especailly if we sell our best players continuously, I'm slightly concerned going forward..

Discuss...

by **Klopptomaniac** » Tue Mar 20, 2018 5:54 pm

Don't sell them. The only 'star' player that's been lost under Jurgens reign is Coutinho - beyond that there's nothing to suggest we're a selling club while he's been here (nice attempt at dangling the rod tho).

Look at the transfers that make us a selling club in their own context:

Masch: Hodgson was manager and the club was going down the pan. Barcelona came calling. He was off. Different owners

Torres: as above switch Barca with Chelsea. Different owners.

Suarez: his missus is a Barca girl, and it's a South American and Barca. May give you this one.

Coutinho: do we really miss Coutinho? Has he gone on to be a megastar? Barca plus the fee, we got a good deal. Jurgen fought tooth and nail to keep him, in the end his heart wasn't in it.

Sterling: why a young English player is on this list baffles me cos he wouldn't get near the side now. He went in the way of money, plus Citys level of investment guarantees league titles, that's the truth.

RBG said we'd see VVD as more important to the side than Coutinho and I agree entirely. Coutinho may have been a star player but we have 3 engines in midfield and a general at the back while the front 3 have maintained scoring the goals. The midfield needs work yes but the squad doesn't need najor surgery.

Long term it's exciting and nowhere near a concern.

We're in the quarter final of the champions league and may secure champions league football 2 seasons in a row for the first time in the last (10?) years and you're worried about keeping our players? Our manager has a hell of a pull and is proving to be one of the best. This is the most excited I've been as a Liverpool fan in years.

In short. Get a grip

by **parchpea** » Tue Mar 20, 2018 6:15 pm

Two things required one is paying bigger wages and the other is showing ambition and buying world class players. This shows these guys they can win and be successful with your club.

Usually a combination of both otherwise they will look elsewhere.

Man City got to this point and are keeping their best players by doing both these things.

by **Eagle** » Tue Mar 20, 2018 6:46 pm

It all comes down to buying well. We’ve been poor at this since FSG came in both compared to our rivals and also compared to how we’ve done with previous owners. We didn’t do very well with Comolli and Kenny and it didn’t work well with Edwards and Rodgers. Far too many poor signings that weren’t used and this has dragged us back. But it’s working now with Edwards and Klopp. Each season the squad has been getting better. Sure it’s slow progress as Klopp prefers a considered approach in the transfer market but it’s all about building with him and that’s what we continue to do.

If we buy well we will consistently get in the Champions League and find it easier to hang onto our players. And buying players doesn’t mean getting bargains. It could mean breaking the world record for a CB as long as he is the right fit. You’ll always lose the odd player here and there but I think we’ll lose less and less considering the direction we are going both on and off the field.

We’ve underperformed buying in the transfer market in recent years but things look like they are on the up on that front.

by **ycsatbjywtbiastkamb** » Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:16 pm

Klopptomaniac » Tue Mar 20, 2018 4:54 pm wrote:Don't sell them. The only 'star' player that's been lost under Jurgens reign is Coutinho - beyond that there's nothing to suggest we're a selling club while he's been here (nice attempt at dangling the rod tho).

Look at the transfers that make us a selling club in their own context:

Masch: Hodgson was manager and the club was going down the pan. Barcelona came calling. He was off. Different owners

Torres: as above switch Barca with Chelsea. Different owners.

Suarez: his missus is a Barca girl, and it's a South American and Barca. May give you this one.

Coutinho: do we really miss Coutinho? Has he gone on to be a megastar? Barca plus the fee, we got a good deal. Jurgen fought tooth and nail to keep him, in the end his heart wasn't in it.

Sterling: why a young English player is on this list baffles me cos he wouldn't get near the side now. He went in the way of money, plus Citys level of investment guarantees league titles, that's the truth.

RBG said we'd see VVD as more important to the side than Coutinho and I agree entirely. Coutinho may have been a star player but we have 3 engines in midfield and a general at the back while the front 3 have maintained scoring the goals. The midfield needs work yes but the squad doesn't need najor surgery.

Long term it's exciting and nowhere near a concern.

We're in the quarter final of the champions league and may secure champions league football 2 seasons in a row for the first time in the last (10?) years and you're worried about keeping our players? Our manager has a hell of a pull and is proving to be one of the best. This is the most excited I've been as a Liverpool fan in years.

In short. Get a grip

What has the sale of Coutinho got to do with VVD? The idea is to try and keep all your good players, how many trophies do you think we would have won in our 70's and 80's heyday if we would have sold Kevin Keegan or Kenny Dalglish to bring in Alan Hansen and Mark Lawrenson?

by **Klopptomaniac** » Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:51 pm

ycsatbjywtbiastkamb » Tue Mar 20, 2018 6:16 pm wrote:
Klopptomaniac » Tue Mar 20, 2018 4:54 pm wrote:Don't sell them. The only 'star' player that's been lost under Jurgens reign is Coutinho - beyond that there's nothing to suggest we're a selling club while he's been here (nice attempt at dangling the rod tho).

Look at the transfers that make us a selling club in their own context:

Masch: Hodgson was manager and the club was going down the pan. Barcelona came calling. He was off. Different owners

Torres: as above switch Barca with Chelsea. Different owners.

Suarez: his missus is a Barca girl, and it's a South American and Barca. May give you this one.

Coutinho: do we really miss Coutinho? Has he gone on to be a megastar? Barca plus the fee, we got a good deal. Jurgen fought tooth and nail to keep him, in the end his heart wasn't in it.

Sterling: why a young English player is on this list baffles me cos he wouldn't get near the side now. He went in the way of money, plus Citys level of investment guarantees league titles, that's the truth.

RBG said we'd see VVD as more important to the side than Coutinho and I agree entirely. Coutinho may have been a star player but we have 3 engines in midfield and a general at the back while the front 3 have maintained scoring the goals. The midfield needs work yes but the squad doesn't need najor surgery.

Long term it's exciting and nowhere near a concern.

We're in the quarter final of the champions league and may secure champions league football 2 seasons in a row for the first time in the last (10?) years and you're worried about keeping our players? Our manager has a hell of a pull and is proving to be one of the best. This is the most excited I've been as a Liverpool fan in years.

In short. Get a grip

What has the sale of Coutinho got to do with VVD? The idea is to try and keep all your good players, how many trophies do you think we would have won in our 70's and 80's heyday if we would have sold Kevin Keegan or Kenny Dalglish to bring in Alan Hansen and Mark Lawrenson?

It's given the side better balance imo. Trying to play all 4 in the side fully fit at all times would have been a problem. Obviously they could have rotated but in terms of an 11 we have a better balance.

Though I was more saying it as a means of calming all the hysteria over him being sold.

by **Ghost of Shankly** » Tue Mar 20, 2018 9:27 pm

I'm not panicking over losing our players. It is Inevitable that big bids for Salah will arrive if he plays this well next season also.

Loyalty is another reason players will stay also, as well as our clubs ambition and signing decent players.
Stephen Gerrard had many opportunities to leave during his career etc, but chose to stay, especially after Rafa left. The same cannot be said for Suarez, Torres, Sterling, Coutinho and also Michael Owen (When Rafa first took over), they all wanted out.

Salah has allegedly said in the media he wants to win titles with us, hopefully that is true. I'd like him to stay for at least five seasons, if possible. If necessary give him a pay rise.

by **metalhead** » Wed Mar 21, 2018 11:35 am

Yawn

we are not a selling club

The better we do on the pitch the more enthusiastic our top players will be to stay.

If we start winning trophies and challenging for titles then players like Salah, Mane and Firmino will stay.

by **johnbarnes** » Wed Mar 21, 2018 12:07 pm

metalhead » Wed Mar 21, 2018 11:35 am wrote:Yawn

we are not a selling club

The better we do on the pitch the more enthusiastic our top players will be to stay.

If we start winning trophies and challenging for titles then players like Salah, Mane and Firmino will stay.

+1 ^^^
It's getting a bit boring reading the same ol' critical ***** about the state the team when the team is playing and performing well.
Away from the poor start to the season we had WITH CUN.TINO! Leading up to and after Xmas we have been as consistent as $hitie or anyone else in the league.
---
Just wish those posters who clearly have nothing better to do between now and our next game would just feck off and have a long comfortable wan.k
There are so many better POSITIVE things to discuss like:
1. Who will succeed after JK has gone? We will start recruiting from within like the olden golden days?
etc...
---
But I know that won't happen. So just like with pretty much every negative thread on this forum.
I say - I'M OUT!
Leave you guys to discuss totally irrelevant SH!TE.

by **ycsatbjywtbiastkamb** » Wed Mar 21, 2018 1:54 pm

Klopptomaniac » Tue Mar 20, 2018 6:51 pm wrote:
ycsatbjywtbiastkamb » Tue Mar 20, 2018 6:16 pm wrote:
Klopptomaniac » Tue Mar 20, 2018 4:54 pm wrote:Don't sell them. The only 'star' player that's been lost under Jurgens reign is Coutinho - beyond that there's nothing to suggest we're a selling club while he's been here (nice attempt at dangling the rod tho).

Look at the transfers that make us a selling club in their own context:

Masch: Hodgson was manager and the club was going down the pan. Barcelona came calling. He was off. Different owners

Torres: as above switch Barca with Chelsea. Different owners.

Suarez: his missus is a Barca girl, and it's a South American and Barca. May give you this one.

Coutinho: do we really miss Coutinho? Has he gone on to be a megastar? Barca plus the fee, we got a good deal. Jurgen fought tooth and nail to keep him, in the end his heart wasn't in it.

Sterling: why a young English player is on this list baffles me cos he wouldn't get near the side now. He went in the way of money, plus Citys level of investment guarantees league titles, that's the truth.

RBG said we'd see VVD as more important to the side than Coutinho and I agree entirely. Coutinho may have been a star player but we have 3 engines in midfield and a general at the back while the front 3 have maintained scoring the goals. The midfield needs work yes but the squad doesn't need najor surgery.

Long term it's exciting and nowhere near a concern.

We're in the quarter final of the champions league and may secure champions league football 2 seasons in a row for the first time in the last (10?) years and you're worried about keeping our players? Our manager has a hell of a pull and is proving to be one of the best. This is the most excited I've been as a Liverpool fan in years.

In short. Get a grip

What has the sale of Coutinho got to do with VVD? The idea is to try and keep all your good players, how many trophies do you think we would have won in our 70's and 80's heyday if we would have sold Kevin Keegan or Kenny Dalglish to bring in Alan Hansen and Mark Lawrenson?

It's given the side better balance imo. Trying to play all 4 in the side fully fit at all times would have been a problem. Obviously they could have rotated but in terms of an 11 we have a better balance.

Though I was more saying it as a means of calming all the hysteria over him being sold.

Well going by your logic the smart thing to do in the summer would be to sell Mo and bring in some other players who will give us even more balance. Selling your best players isn't the way forward mate, even if we are still scoring goals the loss of Coutinho mid season may still come back to bite us on the @rse.
One thing that has happened since Phil's departure is that Jurgen has been forced to play Mo, Bobby and Sadio in practically every game, with such a heavy workload there's a real possibility that one of them could get injured or they could run out of steam just as the season enters its most crucial stage.
The wheels came off us big time down the home straight last season and that was without CL football, let's hope all that rotation early on in the season is enough to get us over the line.
We are in a good position now but it would only take 2 or 3 bad results to see us out of the CL and finishing 5th, things are finely balanced. I'm not actually looking forward to the Palace game, it can be a tricky place to go (they nearly turned City over there) and they have the likes of Zaha and Sakho back now. Lots of our fans seem to be looking past that game and concentrating on the City games and the derby game but I think that game will be tougher than the Everton one.

by **maguskwt** » Wed Mar 21, 2018 4:00 pm

We ARE a selling club... at least that's how rest of europe sees us, whatever the reasons for players leaving. There is an impression that if you try hard enough and with enough money, we WILL part with our best players. Masherano, Alonso, Torres, Suarez, Sterling, Coutinho all left without the managers wanting them to leave. It doesn't matter what became of them when they leave us. Some succeeded like Alonso, Mash, Suarez, some failed like Torres. Doesn't mean Sh*t to us.

How to avoid this? By showing ambition and win things. How to win things? by keeping your best players and avoiding the endless loop of rebuilding. Simple as that. Just because recently we had been more balanced after selling Couts, doesn't mean that that is something that will always happen after selling your best player.

by **metalhead** » Wed Mar 21, 2018 5:43 pm

maguskwt » Wed Mar 21, 2018 3:00 pm wrote:We ARE a selling club... at least that's how rest of europe sees us, whatever the reasons for players leaving. There is an impression that if you try hard enough and with enough money, we WILL part with our best players. Masherano, Alonso, Torres, Suarez, Sterling, Coutinho all left without the managers wanting them to leave. It doesn't matter what became of them when they leave us. Some succeeded like Alonso, Mash, Suarez, some failed like Torres. Doesn't mean Sh*t to us.

How to avoid this? By showing ambition and win things. How to win things? by keeping your best players and avoiding the endless loop of rebuilding. Simple as that. Just because recently we had been more balanced after selling Couts, doesn't mean that that is something that will always happen after selling your best player.

Nah we are not.

Bar Coutinho, which top player did we sell under Klopp?

All others players that Klopp sold were either deadwood or players the manager didn't rate at all.

In coutinho's case it was his dream move

so how are we a selling club?

by **Ghost of Shankly** » Wed Mar 21, 2018 6:06 pm

johnbarnes » Wed Mar 21, 2018 12:07 pm wrote:
metalhead » Wed Mar 21, 2018 11:35 am wrote:Yawn

we are not a selling club

The better we do on the pitch the more enthusiastic our top players will be to stay.

If we start winning trophies and challenging for titles then players like Salah, Mane and Firmino will stay.

+1 ^^^
1. Who will succeed after JK has gone? We will start recruiting from within like the olden golden days?
etc...
---

So your putting the nail in Jurgens' coffin already!?

Maybe we can give the job to Roy Evans. Maybe his missus can be the kit man. Graham Souness can be the first team coach again, just like the old days.

by **Ghost of Shankly** » Wed Mar 21, 2018 6:08 pm

metalhead » Wed Mar 21, 2018 5:43 pm wrote:
maguskwt » Wed Mar 21, 2018 3:00 pm wrote:We ARE a selling club... at least that's how rest of europe sees us, whatever the reasons for players leaving. There is an impression that if you try hard enough and with enough money, we WILL part with our best players. Masherano, Alonso, Torres, Suarez, Sterling, Coutinho all left without the managers wanting them to leave. It doesn't matter what became of them when they leave us. Some succeeded like Alonso, Mash, Suarez, some failed like Torres. Doesn't mean Sh*t to us.

How to avoid this? By showing ambition and win things. How to win things? by keeping your best players and avoiding the endless loop of rebuilding. Simple as that. Just because recently we had been more balanced after selling Couts, doesn't mean that that is something that will always happen after selling your best player.

Nah we are not.

Bar Coutinho, which top player did we sell under Klopp?

All others players that Klopp sold were either deadwood or players the manager didn't rate at all.

In coutinho's case it was his dream move

so how are we a selling club?

It's not just under Jurgen. It goes beyond that, read the above posts carefully then come back with further comment.

by **woof woof !** » Wed Mar 21, 2018 6:38 pm

FOR F@CKS SAKE :veryangry

Sick and tired of some of the ***** that's posted in here :kungfu:

Let me try and simplify if for those of you with less than half a brain.

Are we a selling club ?

NO !

Do we sell players that are adamant they no longer want to be here ?

YES !

Imagine, if you can, whatever job you're in, you tell your boss you want to leave and he say's "You can't leave, you are contracted to us"

How easy would it then be for you to just say "f*ck it" and when it suits you give less than your best and at the same time become a negative influence to your "work mates"

Meanwhile your boss has received massive offers from another "company" for your services, he can of course hang onto an unhappy and under performing you for a while longer as your contract winds down and then see you walk away for free.

Suarez himself said "Liverpool did everything they could to keep me but I wanted to go"

All the other "star" names we've sold had also made it more than clear that they wanted to GO !

All the "star" players we've sold had one thing in common

Suarez wanted to go

Torres wanted to go

Masherano wanted to go

Owen wanted to go

And even Kevin Keegan (after we'd won the European Cup) wanted to go.

Just hope some in here will get a grip and realise that when a player has their heart set on leaving sometimes the best option is to wish them well and move on.

BTW Neymar moved to PSG ! are Barca a selling club ? :kungfu:

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