Liverpool FC Forum

by **red till i die!!** » Sat Jan 02, 2016 8:40 pm

Only caught the 1st half and that was enough. We didn't look like getting anything then so i'm not surprised we didn't in the end :down:

The bottom line is we have a bunch of below average footballers assembled from a bunch of lower clubs. In reality we are where we should be because of the players we signed and what is killing me is that not one winner exists among the lot of them :down:

by **redshade** » Sat Jan 02, 2016 9:17 pm

I feel for the remainder of the season will be a yo yo effect from 9th-6th back and forth. I can't see us cracking into the top 4.

by **ethanr** » Sat Jan 02, 2016 10:33 pm

Big decisions have not been going our way the last few weeks- Moreno's goal wrongly called off against Newcastle, The ball being kicked out of Bogdan's hand, Moreno being fouled today, We should've had a penalty from the handball late in the second half. It's sad we could have drawn this game if decisions would've gone our way considering we played so poorly.

We definitely deserved to lose that game. Benteke is completely useless if you play him through. He probably had 10 chances today that he skied over the bar or completely mishit. It's time we start looking for another option. I still think a quick dangerous on the floor striker could pair well with Benteke, but him alone has been a disaster. One problem we are having is that we are a tiny team. Lucas, Firmino, Coutinho, Allen, Ibe- They're all very short and yet we continue to batter the ball in the air up the pitch. Benteke is the only one, but he was easily crowded out by Collins and Tompkins. Collins is only good in the air, he's awful on the ground yet we played right into him. What really killed us today was how often our CB's and midfielders gave the ball away with simple routine passes up the middle. Just constantly poor passes, and poor touches.

I'm still never seeing us with a plan under Klopp. Originally it seemed we were going to high-press and try to win every ball, then quickly counter. That worked against City and Chelsea, but we don't look like we've tried to do it since.

by **Mikz** » Sat Jan 02, 2016 11:27 pm

devaney » Sat Jan 02, 2016 7:16 pm wrote:
johnbarnes » Sat Jan 02, 2016 5:59 pm wrote:RE; Players Wages
Our generation has created real life Monsters who just eat everything in their way. We see it within our children and the rest of society. This young generation simply do not give a sh!t about anyone or anything but themselves.
I'll go down on record that WE WILL beat Arsenal next week. Not because we are better than them. It's just simply that the players will have personal value to beating a v.good side - The Instagram / Twitter daily feed is to great for them not to give it their all. A nice selfie in the L4 dressing room posing like the posers they are say "Look at me. I'm great, because I just beat Arsenal!"
We are now reaping what we have sowed for the last 1\4 century...
In a single word. SPOILT!

And you recently had the fkg audacity to wonder why I support LFC and that I should try drinking a 40 year old bottle of Malt Whiskey in an attempt to put a smile on my face !! Well having just read your whingathon I don't think a crate of the stuff would sort you out CHEER UP JB FFS !!!

As for us beating Arsenal you maybe right if Arsenal play as badly as Chelsea, City and Leicester because make no mistake they were all very poor when we beat them !!

If your right about most players not caring and being prima donnas then what is going on at Watford, Leicester, West Ham and Crystal Palace. I'll tell you what's going on. They have all changed their manager who in turn has made a significant difference. Crystal Palace were falling to pieces before Pardew took over and within no time he got the same players performing at a level that not even their own fans thought possible. This is why JB I expect to see massively improved levels of determination, passion and desire as a result of us paying £7m a year for the services of JK. Gone are the days when you are allowed time to develop. Fans and owners expect immediate results and that is why they pay crazy money. So far I have not seen one single ounce of improvement. Our own fans suggest that Klopp needs time and that he hasn't even had a transfer window yet. Well Leicester last summer spent less on 6/7 players than we did on Firmino or Benteke. Surely an incredible amount of their success is down to the manager and his assistants or am I missing something?

Spot on..but i think our problem is desire in that we dont have any, wether its with the euros approaching or just general wimpmanship i cant understand it.

by **parchpea** » Sat Jan 02, 2016 11:28 pm

Moreno was definately fouled prior to their first but in this moment we saw everything that is rotten about the team.

I played competeitive football until I was aged 42 and If I lost the ball high up, foul or not, you leg it back into position or die trying, you dont lie on the floor moaning and vacate your position.

What an embarresment again today.

by **RED BEERGOGGLES** » Sat Jan 02, 2016 11:51 pm

We did want to win that game didn't we ? Only given its importance owing to how many places we would have jumped I wasn't convinced by the application.
It seems we've not only lost the spine of the team ,we've actually spent millions procuring player's bereft of backbones ,its a small miracle these shithouses can walk upright given their obvious disabilities. I honestly don't believe I've felt this embarrassed watching the team I support besmirch the badge with such contempt for the watching fans. This display was worse than Watford ,at least Watford looked a competent outfit ,but this West Ham side are awful and they beat us at a canter.

I'm absolutely livid tonight ,we have one of the best managers in the game and he's already being undermined by the biggest collection of shithouse rats ever assembled .Klopp has exposed these players for what they are ,they've been asked to play a certain way for a new manager that many players the length and breadth of Europe would give their high teeth to play under ,and they cant even give him the fight.

Embarrassing isn't a strong enough word for the lack of effort shown earlier.

by **ycsatbjywtbiastkamb** » Sat Jan 02, 2016 11:52 pm

parchpea » Sat Jan 02, 2016 10:28 pm wrote:Moreno was definately fouled prior to their first but in this moment we saw everything that is rotten about the team.

I played competeitive football until I was aged 42 and If I lost the ball high up, foul or not, you leg it back into position or die trying, you dont lie on the floor moaning and vacate your position.

What an embarresment again today.

Exactly, thats what I was saying earlier, he was more interested in trying to milk a free kick that obviously wasn't going to be given than getting back into position. When he was on the floor we were essentially down to 10 men which means while he was enjoying his little rest his team mates were having to work 10% harder just to achieve parity.
We are a mid table side because we have players with a mid table mindset, you only have to look at the amount of times we've capitulated to teams that we should be beating over the last 12 months, it happens that often these days you almost expect it.

by **ycsatbjywtbiastkamb** » Sat Jan 02, 2016 11:58 pm

RED BEERGOGGLES » Sat Jan 02, 2016 10:51 pm wrote:We did want to win that game didn't we ? Only given its importance owing to how many places we would have jumped I wasn't convinced by the application.
It seems we've not only lost the spine of the team ,we've actually spent millions procuring player's bereft of backbones ,its a small miracle these shithouses can walk upright given their obvious disabilities. I honestly don't believe I've felt this embarrassed watching the team I support besmirch the badge with such contempt for the watching fans. This display was worse than Watford ,at least Watford looked a competent outfit ,but this West Ham side are awful and they beat us at a canter.

I'm absolutely livid tonight ,we have one of the best managers in the game and he's already being undermined by the biggest collection of shithouse rats ever assembled .Klopp has exposed these players for what they are ,they've been asked to play a certain way for a new manager that many players the length and breadth of Europe would give their high teeth to play under ,and they cant even give him the fight.

Embarrassing isn't a strong enough word for the lack of effort shown earlier.

Well said mate

by **johnbarnes** » Sun Jan 03, 2016 12:41 am

devaney » Sat Jan 02, 2016 8:16 pm wrote:
johnbarnes » Sat Jan 02, 2016 5:59 pm wrote:RE; Players Wages
Our generation has created real life Monsters who just eat everything in their way. We see it within our children and the rest of society. This young generation simply do not give a sh!t about anyone or anything but themselves.
I'll go down on record that WE WILL beat Arsenal next week. Not because we are better than them. It's just simply that the players will have personal value to beating a v.good side - The Instagram / Twitter daily feed is to great for them not to give it their all. A nice selfie in the L4 dressing room posing like the posers they are say "Look at me. I'm great, because I just beat Arsenal!"
We are now reaping what we have sowed for the last 1\4 century...
In a single word. SPOILT!

And you recently had the fkg audacity to wonder why I support LFC and that I should try drinking a 40 year old bottle of Malt Whiskey in an attempt to put a smile on my face !! Well having just read your whingathon I don't think a crate of the stuff would sort you out CHEER UP JB FFS !!!

As for us beating Arsenal you maybe right if Arsenal play as badly as Chelsea, City and Leicester because make no mistake they were all very poor when we beat them !!

If your right about most players not caring and being prima donnas then what is going on at Watford, Leicester, West Ham and Crystal Palace. I'll tell you what's going on. They have all changed their manager who in turn has made a significant difference. Crystal Palace were falling to pieces before Pardew took over and within no time he got the same players performing at a level that not even their own fans thought possible. This is why JB I expect to see massively improved levels of determination, passion and desire as a result of us paying £7m a year for the services of JK. Gone are the days when you are allowed time to develop. Fans and owners expect immediate results and that is why they pay crazy money. So far I have not seen one single ounce of improvement. Our own fans suggest that Klopp needs time and that he hasn't even had a transfer window yet. Well Leicester last summer spent less on 6/7 players than we did on Firmino or Benteke. Surely an incredible amount of their success is down to the manager and his assistants or am I missing something?

Klopp requires and deserves the respect of time to get this right (The very fact that you believe he should be getting more from these kids is outrageous) IMO.
The reason for this is that FSG's remit was/is to buy the brightest young talent their $$$ could purchase. To an extent they have achieved this. BUT - WE NOW LACK LEADERS!
All the teams you have mentioned are not making purchases for future development. Their newly found PL monies are going into the market to purchase established seasoned professionals, most of which are journey men. But a journey man is more reliable and can hit the ground running much faster than a kid that doesn't know his head from his ar$e. Basically my point is - WE NEED TO LAY OFF KLOPP - It just isn't his fault that he has inherited the youngest squad in the PL (Villa possibly being the exception) and turn them into champions elect. IT SIMPLY WILL NOT HAPPEN - If I'm wrong, then why did FSG decide to get rid of the previous management?

FSG realised that the 'False One' had NO CLUE how to build and assemble a strong squad...
So they have brought someone who DOES HAVE A CLUE - Not a miracle worker - But someone who knows how to build.
IF WE can not except that we are building for the future, then as quoted before, we may as well down a bottle of 40 year Scotch! :wwww

Did Klopp say that he inherited a v good squad - Of course he did! He's not going to come into a new club with gloom and doom. More to the point Klopp now has to maintain the market value at which we paid for these players, otherwise the $$$ lose when some of the players leave the club will be massive. KLOPP is a highly intelligent bloke; that I have no doubt. He's tried to play a cool hand of Poker, but the reality is that the likes of Pardew, Pulis etc have called his hand.
AGAIN - It's not his fault that he hasn't got pocket aces!

by **killerp** » Sun Jan 03, 2016 1:09 am

RED BEERGOGGLES » Sat Jan 02, 2016 10:51 pm wrote:...we have one of the best managers in the game and he's already being undermined by the biggest collection of shithouse rats ever assembled....

I feel the same way but I place the majority of the blame straight to the top. Who the fook signed off on Benteke and Firminho as a massive last punt before they sacked Rodgers! knowing full well he was 95% gone after that massive defeat end of last season.

by **devaney** » Sun Jan 03, 2016 10:04 am

To quote JB Klopp requires and deserves the respect of time to get this right (The very fact that you believe he should be getting more from these kids is outrageous)

Ok JB I'm a reasonable sort of a bloke so you got me thinking am I being total unfair to JK expecting more at this stage.

You suggest that I am being outrageous expecting him to get more out of these kids. I am not sure how you determine a kid in age or football terms? The vast majority of players have reached an advanced level in development by the age of 23/25. So just how old are the players that he has used mainly since he arrived:

Mignolet 27
Milner 29
Toure 34
Lovren 26
Skrtel 31
Clyne 24
Ibe 20
Lucas 28
Can 21
Henderson 25
Origi 20
Coutinho 23
Ings 23
Moreno 23
Sakho 25
Allen 25
Lallana 27
Sturridge 26
Benteke 25

In no way do I regard that list of players as a bunch of kids. The majority have played at international level. Sakho has captained the french national team. Milner has a mountain of experience and certainly has leadership qualities. The same can be said of Kolo Toure and Martin Skrtel.

Having looked at that list and their combined experience in no way do I regard my observation that we have not improved since JK's arrival as unreasonable. Our performance over the last 7 games has been as bad as anything I have seen for a very long time coming out of LFC. No passion, desire, creation or determination. JK is regarded as a great motivator. Does the team look motivated to you? Look back at the the team that won the 2005 CL. On paper they should have been nowhere near the final let alone winning it. The team that played against City displayed all the missing ingredients so just what has happened since then because we have gone backwards?

Hopefully JK will turn this around. At the moment most fans simply blame Rogers for most of the clubs problems. I find that a very easy way to to draw a simple conclusion. Forgive me if I don't share that view or regard players aged 23 and over as kids !!

If nothing else at least we are second in one league and a long way ahead of third place !! http://www.physioroom.com/news/english_ ... _table.php

by **eds** » Sun Jan 03, 2016 11:02 am

Fking hell I knew drinking that Kool-Aid s**t would mess with your mind, you have gone completely bat-st*t insane.

18 games, 9 wins, 5 draws and 4 loses. Yet somehow you want Klopp to have won more games with the bunch of players we currently have. :no

As much as you hate hearing it, we will repeat it again BODGERS F**KED THIS CLUB UP WITH HIS INEPTITUDE AND PURILE signings, Klopp is doing a master job even winning games at the moment.

Pointing to some ridiculous argument that lower league clubs brought in managers who turned them around is truly pathetic.

The law of averages will dictate that this happens EVERY SEASON with a different set of clubs.

Come back to me next season when we see either Leicester, Palace, West Ham, Watford sustain their efforts?

Some of them will be lucky to escape relegation, but hey by then your argument would have shifted to something else.

That's OK though, because by then the German would have started bringing in his own players and started turning around our fortunes ramming down your weak agenda driven attack on him straight back down your throat.......

by **johnbarnes** » Sun Jan 03, 2016 12:00 pm

devaney » Sun Jan 03, 2016 10:04 am wrote:To quote JB Klopp requires and deserves the respect of time to get this right (The very fact that you believe he should be getting more from these kids is outrageous)

Ok JB I'm a reasonable sort of a bloke so you got me thinking am I being total unfair to JK expecting more at this stage.

You suggest that I am being outrageous expecting him to get more out of these kids. I am not sure how you determine a kid in age or football terms? The vast majority of players have reached an advanced level in development by the age of 23/25. So just how old are the players that he has used mainly since he arrived:

Mignolet 27
Milner 29
Toure 34
Lovren 26
Skrtel 31
Clyne 24
Ibe 20
Lucas 28
Can 21
Henderson 25
Origi 20
Coutinho 23
Ings 23
Moreno 23
Sakho 25
Allen 25
Lallana 27
Sturridge 26
Benteke 25

In no way do I regard that list of players as a bunch of kids. The majority have played at international level. Sakho has captained the french national team. Milner has a mountain of experience and certainly has leadership qualities. The same can be said of Kolo Toure and Martin Skrtel.

Having looked at that list and their combined experience in no way do I regard my observation that we have not improved since JK's arrival as unreasonable. Our performance over the last 7 games has been as bad as anything I have seen for a very long time coming out of LFC. No passion, desire, creation or determination. JK is regarded as a great motivator. Does the team look motivated to you? Look back at the the team that won the 2005 CL. On paper they should have been nowhere near the final let alone winning it. The team that played against City displayed all the missing ingredients so just what has happened since then because we have gone backwards?

Hopefully JK will turn this around. At the moment most fans simply blame Rogers for most of the clubs problems. I find that a very easy way to to draw a simple conclusion. Forgive me if I don't share that view or regard players aged 23 and over as kids !!

If nothing else at least we are second in one league and a long way ahead of third place !! http://www.physioroom.com/news/english_premier_league/epl_injury_table.php

OK Devaney! You have convinced me that Klopp is not the 2nd coming... In fact you are! Please go and get your UEFA badges and manage our beloved club as we (especially I) need someone who without a shadow of doubt can walk on water and turn our fortunes. Please do not take this as patronisation - After 25 years the FUK.ING Penguin (Batman) could take over the running of this club providing he get the results. I Just don't care anymore! So your argument seems a very simple one and your posts read like they have the answers.
So as Mickey said to Rocky after Adrianne woke up out of her coma and I'll say it to you as a loyal follow as you've convinced me... "WHAT ARE WE WAITING FOR!"
Over to you Devaney!

by **johnbarnes** » Sun Jan 03, 2016 12:00 pm

eds » Sun Jan 03, 2016 11:02 am wrote:Fking hell I knew drinking that Kool-Aid s**t would mess with your mind, you have gone completely bat-st*t insane.

18 games, 9 wins, 5 draws and 4 loses. Yet somehow you want Klopp to have won more games with the bunch of players we currently have. :no

As much as you hate hearing it, we will repeat it again BODGERS F**KED THIS CLUB UP WITH HIS INEPTITUDE AND PURILE signings, Klopp is doing a master job even winning games at the moment.

Pointing to some ridiculous argument that lower league clubs brought in managers who turned them around is truly pathetic.

The law of averages will dictate that this happens EVERY SEASON with a different set of clubs.

Come back to me next season when we see either Leicester, Palace, West Ham, Watford sustain their efforts?

Some of them will be lucky to escape relegation, but hey by then your argument would have shifted to something else.

That's OK though, because by then the German would have started bringing in his own players and started turning around our fortunes ramming down your weak agenda driven attack on him straight back down your throat.......

+1 ^^^

by **C-R** » Sun Jan 03, 2016 12:26 pm

Chris Bascombe (telegraph) says we have a 20 million £ january budget and deals are already in place :eyebrow

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