Liverpool FC Forum

eds » Thu Dec 06, 2012 1:57 am wrote:

Kharhaz » Thu Dec 06, 2012 12:01 am wrote:

bunglemark2 » Thu Dec 06, 2012 12:50 am wrote:eds: don't sit on the fence.....what exactly are you trying to say ?

I think, and I could be wrong here, hes on a male form of on....

And that fact that you have been silenced into submission, makes you a......... 

Submission? no, not at all. I saw nothing but insults in your post and decided to reply on that. So ok, lets reply to your "evidence". You have not taken into account the lengthy injury he had when he signed, nor have you taken into account the amount of times Dalglish left him on the bench. You decided to pop up the amount of appearances he made while neglecting to mention that many of those were as a sub.

Silenced, no not all, I simply get tired of replying to "fans" with an agenda.

[quote="Kharhaz » Thu Dec 06, 2012 2:27 am

Submission? no, not at all. I saw nothing but insults in your post and decided to reply on that. So ok, lets reply to your "evidence". You have not taken into account the lengthy injury he had when he signed, nor have you taken into account the amount of times Dalglish left him on the bench. You decided to pop up the amount of appearances he made while neglecting to mention that many of those were as a sub.

Silenced, no not all, I simply get tired of replying to "fans" with an agenda.[/quote]

He had a lengthy injury when we bought him in 2011 not last season 2011 / 2012, which is what we are talking about.....So what does have to do with the price of tea in China? 

Dalglish left him on the bench because every time he played he would just jog around like a lazy lug and would be NO WHERE near close to being the threat that Suarez was.

Once again why are you avoiding the main point you made? What made Andy Carroll "unplayable" last season? Was it the little shuffle in FA cup? Or a string of goals in some meaningless games towards the end of the season? 

I simply get tired of replying to "fans" with an agenda.

And what agenda is that? Not having a pop at you this time but do you actually know what an "agenda" is?

eds » Thu Dec 06, 2012 4:53 am wrote:And what agenda is that? Not having a pop at you this time but do you actually know what an "agenda" is?

Every supporter today has an agenda, whether it be in support of past managers (Benitez), or present day players (Suarez). The Agenda takes precedence over the support of the club.

Whereas I want every member of our club to do well, the agenda of many supporters are to justify every decision made, wrong or right, with every individiual decision made with regards to our club taken as gospel.

I see so many arguments with every decision taken, especially with our club, I simply look at how things are.

So many times, on so many forums, people are arguing petty little decisions without looking at the bigger picture. The bigger picture being, mistakes are made, and in this no forgiveness is given. And so an agenda forms, and its wrong.

Kharhaz » Thu Dec 06, 2012 4:19 am wrote:

eds » Thu Dec 06, 2012 4:53 am wrote:And what agenda is that? Not having a pop at you this time but do you actually know what an "agenda" is?

Every supporter today has an agenda, whether it be in support of past managers (Benitez), or present day players (Suarez). The Agenda takes precedence over the support of the club.

Whereas I want every member of our club to do well, the agenda of many supporters are to justify every decision made, wrong or right, with every individiual decision made with regards to our club taken as gospel.

I see so many arguments with every decision taken, especially with our club, I simply look at how things are.

So many times, on so many forums, people are arguing petty little decisions without looking at the bigger picture. The bigger picture being, mistakes are made, and in this no forgiveness is given. And so an agenda forms, and its wrong.

Thanks for clarifying that.

Looks like you are definately confused with what an "opinion" is and what an "agenda" is.

In the purest sense you can't actually have AN AGENDA if you support Liverpool FC. As this should supercede anything else which gets in the way of supporting your club. Let me rephrase what you are actually saying:

Every supporter today has an agenda, whether it be in support of past managers (Benitez), or present day players (Suarez). The Agenda takes precedence over the support of the club.

Wrong. Every supporter has an OPINION. Whether it be in support of past managers, past players, current manager, current players. Sometimes this opinion can take precedence over anything logical that is said, for example when you say "I love my club so much that I think Andy Carroll was "unplayable" last season" I can understand that you love the club lad and want him to do well and our club, but unfortunately you are in the (very small) minority of thinking he will improve us as a football club. We all love Liverpool FC and we all want out club to do well but the evidence provided (and the lack of which you have provided, outside of making a sweeping statement on his playing ability) proves this. He sat on the bench because Kenny realised he made a mistake and thats why Suarez got more time than him, because he is a better player then him  I really hope that makes sense. Its got nothing to do with us wanting one player to do better than another, its brutal mate, but thats the world we live in, your either good enough or your not.

Back to what you said:

Whereas I want every member of our club to do well, the agenda of many supporters are to justify every decision made, wrong or right, with every individiual decision made with regards to our club taken as gospel.

I'm sorry mate but you would be offending almost everyone on this forum thinking that you have the purest intentions at heart when everyone else is driven by secret consipiracies and agendas of wanting their own opinions justified. I actually think you must be either be a child if you think that way, or at least very, very immature. No one in their right mind would want to be proven right at the cost of our club doing well. For example, when Hodgson was here a lot of fans didn't like him from day one, including myself. I posted my thoughts, but couldn't give a s**t if I had to eat humble pie if Hodgson ended up winning the premiership and many other fans would be in the same boat. Hmmmm admit I'm wrong or Liverpool win the title? Tough choice indeed.

Also you said:

So many times, on so many forums, people are arguing petty little decisions without looking at the bigger picture. The bigger picture being, mistakes are made, and in this no forgiveness is given. And so an agenda forms, and its wrong.

You actually sound very arrogant thinking you know what is a petty little decision and what is the bigger picture. Its a forum mate, people are allowed to micro-analyse any aspect of Liverpool FC if they want. Whether it plays part of the "bigger picture" or not is up for debate and you nor any other self-righteous individual can self impose that. Let me ask you a question, if you were a coach of a side and you had 11 players that were s**t and finished dead last. How would you go about improving the side? Wouldn't you have to correct these mistakes by either getting rid of these players or improving them. Forgiving them has nothing to do with it. Don't be so naive and stupid. This is a competitive sport, to do well you can't keep making the same mistakes by doing the same thing. It is an opinion on how things will improve not an AGENDA. My opinion is to get a better player then Andy Carroll. Your opinion is to keep playing him until it dawns on you that he isn't good enough. Once again that ain't an AGENDA. 

Kharhaz...      you've been owned.

Boxscarf » Wed Dec 05, 2012 9:41 pm wrote:

heimdall » Wed Dec 05, 2012 7:00 pm wrote:
Remind me how many goals he got for us at the end of the season when he was "on fire". Unplayable my @rse. He always was and always will be an utterly cr@p footballer.

Andy Carroll is a very good footballer. However my main problem is the fact that he doesn't seem capable of scoring enough goals. When you buy a striker (irrespective of the amount paid) you expect a good goals return and we just never got that with Andy Carroll. People say "he's dangerous, he causes defenders all sorts of problems" and true he is a dangerous centre-forward and yes he does cause defenders problems, but all of that is meaningless if he doesn't stick the ball into the net. Putting the ball into the net is what wins football matches and with Andy in our team this season, I doubt we would be any higher than we are now.

He's a good footballer, I can understand why we brought him, but he's not what we need. We need another 20 + goals a season striker.

your post is the most balanced one in this discussion and i can see what you are saying but football is a team game, it`s not a game about individuals.
the idea is to get 11 players and turn them into a side greater than the sum of their individual parts.
why do you think we were the best side in europe for a decade with british/irish players when other teams on the continent were spending fortunes on players like cruyff, maradona, ruminegge, breitner, zico, falcao, platini etc?
it`s because we were a team.
carroll is never going to be a prolific goalscorer but what he will do is make the TEAM better by bringing his attributes to the table.
having a player that can dominate the biggest and strongest centre halves in the league like john terry, ivanovic, soto, skrtel etc in a physical battle makes you a tough team to play against.
john toshack scored 5 league goals in his first season at liverpool but a few years later he was part of the best strike partnership in the country and scored the winner at the nou camp to knock barcelona out of europe when they had world record signing johann cruyff in their side.
fans these days would have hounded him out after his first season.

ycsatbjywtbiastkamb » Thu Dec 06, 2012 12:26 pm wrote:what he will do is make the TEAM better by bringing his attributes to the table.

what a load of pish. carroll has the stunning ability to be in the wrong place at the wrong time albiet for the odd occasion when he's positioning is spot on and that is very rare indeed. he's cack mate. admit it.

redno7 » Thu Dec 06, 2012 12:48 pm wrote:

ycsatbjywtbiastkamb » Thu Dec 06, 2012 12:26 pm wrote:what he will do is make the TEAM better by bringing his attributes to the table.

what a load of pish. carroll has the stunning ability to be in the wrong place at the wrong time albiet for the odd occasion when he's positioning is spot on and that is very rare indeed. he's cack mate. admit it.

dont talk $h1te lad, the thing that has warped everyone`s view of carroll is comoli`s ridiculous transfer evaluation.
take that transfer fee out of the equation and he carroll has had an impressive career, especially for a target man centre forward.
have a look at where the likes of drogba, crouch and sheringham were playing at 23 and look at what they`d achieved, and those 3 were all target men CF`s who went on to play in CL finals.

you said 'what he will bring to the team' - I assume you meant Liverpool not his past at Newcastle? If you meant the Toons then yeah, he was sensational. If you meant Liverpool then he's brought fek all. nothing. your the one talking sh!te 'lad' , as per usual. your deluded

redno7 » Thu Dec 06, 2012 1:28 pm wrote:you said 'what he will bring to the team' - I assume you meant Liverpool not his past at Newcastle? If you meant the Toons then yeah, he was sensational. If you meant Liverpool then he's brought fek all. nothing. your the one talking sh!te 'lad' , as per usual. your deluded

nothing? he was our best player during the second half of the season.
did you see the reception carroll got from the fans at anfield whenever he warmed up before he was loaned out?
no you probably didnt.

ycsatbjywtbiastkamb » Thu Dec 06, 2012 1:36 pm wrote:
nothing? he was our best player during the second half of the season.
did you see the reception carroll got from the fans at anfield whenever he warmed up before he was loaned out?
no you probably didnt.

what are you going on about? he was poor. he was good at holding the ball up but thats about it. he had more stinkers than good games. He has a p!sh poor goal per game return for Liverpool...   THATS WHAT WE PAY HIM FOR DUMMY! GOALS!

he didn't really bring any did he?

ycsatbjywtbiastkamb » Thu Dec 06, 2012 1:36 pm wrote:

redno7 » Thu Dec 06, 2012 1:28 pm wrote:you said 'what he will bring to the team' - I assume you meant Liverpool not his past at Newcastle? If you meant the Toons then yeah, he was sensational. If you meant Liverpool then he's brought fek all. nothing. your the one talking sh!te 'lad' , as per usual. your deluded

nothing? he was our best player during the second half of the season.
did you see the reception carroll got from the fans at anfield whenever he warmed up before he was loaned out?
no you probably didnt.

Who got more goals in the second half of the season, Carroll or Suarez? The Liverpool fans give all the players a warm reception, well maybe not Downing 
Hoestly how you can rate Carroll is simply beyond me, he was constnatly in the worng place, was slow, had next to no game intelligence, wasn't good at link up play. The only thing he was ok at was defending which is the position I think suits him best.

Best player in the second half of the season? He was a non entity until about April. He managed to start more games from April until the end of the season but his good performances can be counted on one hand.

West Ham fans are the saying the same things that we were last season. Poor touch, lack of balance, no anticipation in the box, goes to ground too easy, etc.