Liverpool FC Forum

by **Octsky** » Tue Apr 10, 2012 5:08 am

heimdall » Mon Apr 09, 2012 6:44 pm wrote:
Thommo's perm » Mon Apr 09, 2012 4:44 pm wrote:
Octsky » Mon Apr 09, 2012 4:38 pm wrote:can someone pls explain to me what happened to high flying spurs winning almost every game, trashing us, pushing manyoo and then having a losing streak and finally losing to Norwich today ? (after FA wanted Harry for England)

or Ipswich having a fairy tale season, pushing for the champs league spot finally getting a well deserved uefa cup spot and then relegated the next season.

or Kevin Keegan's league leaders Newcastle trashing manyoo 5-0, then going on a winless streak for 8 games in the league.

what changed? did players suddenly became bad ? or has it got to do with motivation? or it is the managers fault?

Its a mixture of things, pressure, lack of belief, too much expectation, mistakes being punished, players going missing or losing form, the list goes on.
The media has a massive effect and is really all powerful as we have seen with regards to Suarez. If anything has changed in football it is the medias influence, as KK has found to his cost

Yes blame everything apart form the real cause, always easier to bury one's head in the sand. As for spurs who gives a *****, if we'd had a decent team and a decent manager then maybe we could have capitalised on it. as it is we could well end up in 14th place unless we figure out how to score goals pretty damn fast.

my point is sometime good teams hit bad patch. some recovers, some dont.
look at gooners at the start of the season, fans are calling for Wenger's head. imagine if they sacked Wenger and appoints Rafa?
it is difficult to pinpoint a sudden run of bad results becoz there are some many factors involved. actually i have confidence in this current team baring Carroll. i still believe this team is actually capable of achieving something big, we need to sign a new forward though.

by **jacdaniel** » Tue Apr 10, 2012 3:39 pm

The strangest thing about liverpool this season and even last is that I can't figure out what kind of team we are. Under Rafa I usually had a fair idea who would start and what system we'd deploy. Now I have no idea at all.

I have no clue what players will start tonight, what our formation will be or what our gameplan will be.

This must be just as confusing for the players as it is for us.

by **heimdall** » Tue Apr 10, 2012 4:06 pm

Thommo's perm » Mon Apr 09, 2012 11:55 pm wrote:
D___C » Mon Apr 09, 2012 11:23 pm wrote:
mart » Mon Apr 09, 2012 10:01 pm wrote:Honestly it was more of a giant fuckup on our part rather than any great "mindtrick" from fergie. We gave him a gift to use, and he used it.

Absolutely... it was an open goal.

I can totally see why Kenny did it.. and i defended him then (Evra is a little shitehawk)... the problem was there was an absence of leadership at the club, we were rudderless during that period. We didnt have anyone understanding the situation (how the media works especially) and it got completely out of hand. We behaved very naively throughout and the press had a field day.

I have had major concerns about the club's ownership from the start.. nothing against Henry/Werner/FSG personally for i think they are classy people and have heard only good things about them from the folk in Boston.... its just a concern about a lack of understanding of how things work here, of player value (would david dein sanction 55 million on carroll and henderson?.. would he f'ck), of appointing someone based on fans calling for it (good pr move initially but it shows a lack of knowing who you want).. also the appointment of a dof in commoli is a huge concern. It doesnt work in England (it generally doesnt work anywhere.. Mourinho got rid of Valdano as he being the manager rightly calls the shots).

There is a real lack of quality leadership at the club at the minute, and its showing on and off the field.

Is there a post where you dont mention how much Carroll cost?

It's a fair point but is there any situation where you accept that we are what we are, and that is a Sh*t team at this present time. And then take the next step to ask why that is and arrive at the conclusion that it might, just might, be Kenny's fault?

by **D___C** » Tue Apr 10, 2012 4:16 pm

jacdaniel » Tue Apr 10, 2012 2:39 pm wrote:The strangest thing about liverpool this season and even last is that I can't figure out what kind of team we are. Under Rafa I usually had a fair idea who would start and what system we'd deploy. Now I have no idea at all.

I have no clue what players will start tonight, what our formation will be or what our gameplan will be.

This must be just as confusing for the players as it is for us.

Really good point.

There doesnt appear to be any method. We also dont have any idea who to pick (only 2 out of the front 6 are nailed on). Thats the problem when you sign badly, you chop and change constantly as none are good enough.

by **damjan193** » Tue Apr 10, 2012 6:07 pm

jacdaniel » Tue Apr 10, 2012 2:39 pm wrote:The strangest thing about liverpool this season and even last is that I can't figure out what kind of team we are. Under Rafa I usually had a fair idea who would start and what system we'd deploy. Now I have no idea at all.

I have no clue what players will start tonight, what our formation will be or what our gameplan will be.

This must be just as confusing for the players as it is for us.

That's because we had only 11 players good enough to start back then. This season we have more depth in our squad. Just look at Juventus. They play with a different starting 11 almost every game and they're first in the league.

by **RedAnt** » Tue Apr 10, 2012 6:12 pm

D___C » Tue Apr 10, 2012 3:16 pm wrote:
jacdaniel » Tue Apr 10, 2012 2:39 pm wrote:The strangest thing about liverpool this season and even last is that I can't figure out what kind of team we are. Under Rafa I usually had a fair idea who would start and what system we'd deploy. Now I have no idea at all.

I have no clue what players will start tonight, what our formation will be or what our gameplan will be.

This must be just as confusing for the players as it is for us.

Really good point.

There doesnt appear to be any method. We also dont have any idea who to pick (only 2 out of the front 6 are nailed on). Thats the problem when you sign badly, you chop and change constantly as none are good enough.

I agree with this...to an extent. But I think that one major factor here is that our so-called strength-in-depth wasn't actually as strong, nor as deep as we initially thought. Downing, Carroll, Hendo and co are all great players to have in a squad. Consider this...as awful as it sounds to me...Andy Carroll playing for Manure as part of a squad. Not as a main striker with all this pressure on him, but as an option, learning his trade. I would bet good money on Carroll banging them in for United. Hendo too would have time to develope, rather than being pushed straight into the first team and be expected to push us up to fourth place. Fact is we sold so many players at the beginning of the season and then assumed our new signings, subsidised by the promising youth and reserve players would be enough. Then for some reason we hardly ever used any of our back ups such as Coates who made very few appearances and never consistantly. This is a major failing of Kenny's, but i'm prepared to give him time yet. One season simply isn't enough to pass judgement on him or any of our new players.

by **Thommo's perm** » Tue Apr 10, 2012 6:20 pm

heimdall:

"It's a fair point but is there any situation where you accept that we are what we are, and that is a Sh*t team at this present time. And then take the next step to ask why that is and arrive at the conclusion that it might, just might, be Kenny's fault?"

I accept that we are playing badly but not necessarily that we have bad players.
The reasons are over expectation and pressure from fans, money spent, low confidence and self belief, media criticism, lack of creative midfielder and leadership on the pitch. Some but not all of this is KKs "fault" but I would rather believe its a team game where everyone has to pull together. I dont think that has happened enough this season and hopefully our last few games, including the FA up will see us having more luck and better results.

by **stmichael** » Wed Apr 11, 2012 2:33 pm

jacdaniel » Tue Apr 10, 2012 3:39 pm wrote:The strangest thing about liverpool this season and even last is that I can't figure out what kind of team we are. Under Rafa I usually had a fair idea who would start and what system we'd deploy. Now I have no idea at all.

I have no clue what players will start tonight, what our formation will be or what our gameplan will be.

This must be just as confusing for the players as it is for us.

i've watched the game back and still have no idea who was playing where at the end

by **RED BEERGOGGLES** » Wed Apr 11, 2012 2:52 pm

The difference a win can make to this forum ,it guarantees a plethora of positive posts . :nod

by **stmichael** » Thu Apr 12, 2012 10:48 pm

they made a good point on the anfield wrap the other day, next season our success will largely be based on how we get the best out of suarez because lets face it, we haven't done it this season. it's almost as if we don't know what role we want him to play. he's never going to be the man to lead the line because he doesn't score enough goals. he needs to play alongside a top class genuine number nine imo. at times this season we've almost had carroll dropping off and playing that role which makes no sense. suarez at times gets isolated far too easily from the rest of our team and he ends up getting frustrated because the players who he could link up well with (bellamy, maxi) are rarely in the side.

by **mart** » Thu Apr 12, 2012 10:56 pm

stmichael » Thu Apr 12, 2012 9:48 pm wrote: suarez at times gets isolated far too easily from the rest of our team and he ends up getting frustrated because the players who he could link up well with (bellamy, suarez) are rarely in the side.

Hmm i think its hard to play Suarez without having Suarez in the side.

by **Octsky** » Sat Apr 14, 2012 3:34 pm

jacdaniel » Tue Apr 10, 2012 2:39 pm wrote:The strangest thing about liverpool this season and even last is that I can't figure out what kind of team we are. Under Rafa I usually had a fair idea who would start and what system we'd deploy. Now I have no idea at all.

I have no clue what players will start tonight, what our formation will be or what our gameplan will be.

This must be just as confusing for the players as it is for us.

Rafa? really? he was with us for 5 seasons, i think he named a same starting lineup less than 20 times.
to prevent further heartache in the FA cup final i hope Kenny gets a better starting lineup - dropping Hendo for Maxi/Bellers and starting Suarez with Carroll.

by **lakes10** » Sat Apr 14, 2012 3:58 pm

think he got it spot on today, we was unlucky to go in 1-0 down, unlike sum i dont think we was that bad in the first half.
in fact if we had not had let in a silly goal i think we was just about the better side in the first half.

by **Penguins** » Sat Apr 14, 2012 4:02 pm

C'mon!
I'd say most people would say we won despite Kenny's selection and tactics.
How many looked at that starting lineup before the game and thought **** **?

I sure did and Kenny is one of the worst when it comes to favouritism.
His british buys can do no wrong and I can see that continuing next season with Henderson and Adam.
Not good enough.. plays next game, plays worse... guaranteed starter next game. That is not good management.

by **lakes10** » Sat Apr 14, 2012 4:04 pm

Penguins » Sat Apr 14, 2012 3:02 pm wrote:C'mon!
I'd say most people would say we won despite Kenny's selection and tactics.
How many looked at that starting lineup before the game and thought **** **?

I sure did and Kenny is one of the worst when it comes to favouritism.
His british buys can do no wrong and I can see that continuing next season with Henderson and Adam.
Not good enough.. plays next game, plays worse... guaranteed starter next game. That is not good management.

no it was a good idea to pack the team full of Brits today, they know what the FA cup is and will not give up when things look down.

and we saw that today.
I think all his buys had good games today.

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