Liverpool FC Forum

by **stmichael** » Mon Oct 04, 2004 2:34 pm

cisse and baros are both very talented individuals but whether they can form a decent partnership i'm not so sure. they may score a fair few goals each when they play but you won't see much of the two interlinking.

by **dawson99** » Mon Oct 04, 2004 2:35 pm

we wont see any interlinking when we play a sole forward. i just think they need a chance to gel coz having one up by himself just isnt working right now

by **stmichael** » Mon Oct 04, 2004 2:39 pm

dawson99 wrote:we wont see any interlinking when we play a sole forward. i just think they need a chance to gel coz having one up by himself just isnt working right now

i agree that rafa needs to ditch this one up malarchy. it's clearly not working because the striker gets no support from the midfield.

however even at home, baros and cisse haven't linked. they're more likely to conjour up a bit of individual brilliance themselves.

by **Redtribe** » Mon Oct 04, 2004 2:39 pm

stmichael wrote:yes jbg, only 7 games gone and yet if we win our game in hand we go 4th. strange old league isn't it? we should also consider the fact that we have got two of the hardest fixtures of the season out of the way already. fulham away, charlton at home and palace at home are the next three games. we win all three and everyone will no doubt be on here claiming how "everything's rosy again" even though they're teams we should be beating anyway.

Exactly St

2 of the hardest fixtures out the way and we can now move on!
If we had got completely thrashed then i could understand people being really down about things but we havnt and we can go 4th with our game in hand!

What did people really expect at the start of the season.
Things were always going to be tough to start with.

I belive after the Jan transfer window things will seem alot different to some people then they do now!

by **stmichael** » Mon Oct 04, 2004 2:44 pm

Redtribe wrote:What did people really expect at the start of the season.
Things were always going to be tough to start with.

I belive after the Jan transfer window things will seem alot different to some people then they do now!

Exactly. Here is a post which i posted a few weeks back which pretty much sums it up i think:

....................................................................................

If there's one thing Liverpool Football Club needs right now, after a period of great flux, it is a period of stability. In all areas: and that includes the fans. Unstable fans: cut back on your caffeine intake, find a dark room, and attempt some deep-breathing exercises. Stable fans: keep the faith, and have patience; hell, you're probably doing that already.

Since May, we've lost a good (but ultimately flawed) manager and gained who I believe to be the right man to lead us forward. Not only that, but the entire coaching staff was overhauled, including the unavoidable loss, to the English national set-up, of Sammy Lee, who many reckoned would get a key role under Rafa. We've lost the man who was our top-scorer for every season since 1997/98 - a former European Footballer of the Year, no less - and came perilously close to losing our best player to southern rivals. The club was centre of a financial battle which generated a lot of column inches in the papers, but no money for the club. Players left, new ones arrived from France and Spain, but none with prior Premiership experience.

A thoroughly indifferent start to the season has ensued: won two, drawn one, lost one, and clumsy passage into the Champions League proper. In league terms, Man United have actually made a worse start than Liverpool, with a lower points average over five games than we have over four.

Rafa faced some stark choices, and thankfully he has chosen to be bold. He could have bought (with our limited budget) average English/British Premiership players this summer (even yard-dogs like Robbie Savage, with their guaranteed effectiveness), or kept the slightly above-average Premiership players, and almost certainly overseen a better start to the season. Gerard Houllier, remaining in charge (in a parallel universe), could no doubt have done the same (although his ability to motivate had waned to dangerous levels). A little cosmetic surgery, and the side would have done okay. But who would have wanted that? - because the ability to do better than okay would have been severely hampered.

Robbie Savage, as a valid example of the Bulldog Spirit some prefer, may look a more effective player than Xabi Alonso for a few weeks, while the latter adjusts to the game here. Savage does a job, much as he is mocked. But within a month or two, you will be comparing an over-revving Mini with a top of the range Ferrari. Isn't it better to go with long term quality ahead of short-term effectiveness? Players like Alonso and Cisse, both just 22, are seen as key to the future of national teams as talented as France and Spain. Whoever else Rafa might have signed, from England or the continent, it's hard to think they'd have more potential than Alonso or Cisse. It might just take time for that potential to come to fruition; and we need to give it time. We can't wait years, but we can surely wait months?

Rafa is rebuilding the side, not tweaking it. This is major work, despite some very special components inherited from the previous regime. Already, in a matter of two months, he has promoted Academy graduates, and signed four new Spaniards and (inherited) a new Frenchman, who have to get to know the way teammates play, while simultaneously adjusting to the Premiership (which takes more getting used to than any other league). Given the fact that he wisely chose, in pre-season, to assess his team first (to make sure he wasn't off-loading players with hidden potential) before acting in the transfer market, it meant that three signings arrived only after our season had started, and arrived from Spain, where the season had yet to start, and therefore physical conditioning levels at the time of their arrival were inevitably lower. They also didn't have those pre-season games to bed in away from the spotlight, and start the gelling process before things got serious.

It is no secret that the Arsenal trio of Bergkamp, Henry and Pires took several months to adjust to the game over here, with each being written off as a waste of money; and yet I'm sure each, for all the team trophies, has won the Player of the Year award. Look at Reyes this season, after nine months bedding in. He looks a different player, and has scored in every game (all but one in midfield). However, Arsenal have the luxury of not having to rely on Reyes (with Pires, Ljungberg and Pennant all capable of filling a wide role, and Bergkamp enjoying an Indian summer), as their Spaniard beds gently into a successful side. We have to rely on our new signings, as Benitez had to replace players who had proven to be not good enough, and one who chose a new challenge at Real Madrid.

We are fools if we do not give them time. Look at another late developer - a player with similar attributes to Djibril Cisse: Pompey's Yakubu. The Nigerian was seen as a bit of a joke figure for many months, and now - with four goals in one game at the end of last season to go with several other strikes after Christmas, and a hat-trick already this season - looks as good as anyone in the top division. If we go down the route of impatience (and I've seen many Liverpool fans suggesting Cisse was a waste of money, Garcia a lightweight luxury, and Alonso an unknown quantity), we could do what Juventus did to Thierry Henry - offloading a player after just 16 games, before he'd had time to settle. Had Arsenal done the same as he initially floundered, where would they be now? Cisse is a little raw, but he has the ability in front of goal to at least equal Owen's yearly totals; it might just take a while to get into his stride.

One problem facing our new players is that they are trying too hard. That might sound illogical to those who think football is 100% effort. But confidence as a sportsman is all about being relaxed. If you are too eager, or anxious, you cannot perform to your best levels. You cannot get into "the zone". All three are quality additions to the side. Cisse's pace and finishing ability - seen in recent seasons in France (where he would have felt comfortable and relaxed in the side, and able to play his natural game) - will be a huge asset once he settles. Alonso's clever positioning and excellent use of the ball - long and short - will be a massive benefit to the way we play, as he can defend and attack. And Garcia's ability to make clever runs and ghost into goalscoring positions, coupled with his ability to create something with his skill, will help make our cutting edge all the sharper - unfortunately against Bolton, Baros failed to play Garcia in for what would have been two more goalscoring opportunites. Josemi is more of a 'steady' player rather than someone capable of the spectacular, but we've already seen glimpses of how good he can be. Nunez remains an unknown quantity, but he will give us options - if only in reserve - once fit.

But they are under a lot of pressure at a time when they are going through personal upheaval, learning a new language, and trying to fit into a new style of football, whilst gelling with teammates. You can understand these players being too anxious to impress. Anyone who's started a new job - even if in the same line of work as a previous one - knows how difficult it can be to find your feet. Imagine the pressure multiplied by the fact that several million people watching your every move. Yes, these are professionals. But they are also human. Judge these players, and the team, at the turn of the year.

by **Ciggy** » Mon Oct 04, 2004 4:10 pm

We have seen worse anway remember last season :glare:

We where pathetic at times we where even worried about beating yeovil ffs, our performances at home against lower teams where pathetic to say the least and frustrating to watch, but ill always love my club always have done always will, even if they got relagated, id probably kill meself first like but id be an LFC supporter in heaven.
LFC walk on.

by **106-1093504160** » Mon Oct 04, 2004 4:30 pm

lets hope we dont end up like spurs in the eighties, if so then shoot me

by **The_Rock** » Mon Oct 04, 2004 4:35 pm

Lets not get carried away. Even with Hamann & Baros in the starting line-up instead of diao & traore, we would have lost to chelsea. They are a great team. Lets give them credit.

Now if we had duff & they had kewell, guess who would have won .....The only reason why chelsea hasn't won all their matches is because duff hasn't played the ones that they didn't win.

In a nutshell, it was a good defensive performace :
a)we can't blame the goal conceded to zonal marking.
b)Cisse looks better in this match (but he did not have enuff support).
c)Carra looks good.
d)If Alonso had scored from the last minute freekick, we would have drawn the match.
e)Having diao, traore & finnan in the team is like a handicap, just imagine how we will perform with vicente, mista & Ayala...

by **Ola Mr Benitez** » Mon Oct 04, 2004 4:51 pm

for Gods sake.. get real will you.. 7 games.. count them and weep!!!! 7.. what where you like 7 days into a new job???

you lot are pathetic... new players, new tactics, new training techniques...

lets re write the script to make you lot happy.

Start of the season and its all new at anfield... but the new spanish stars start with a 10-0 frashing of useless spurs.. Man U away... The mancs say they haven't got a chance against the most succesful team in England ever so don't bother to turn up... Rio gets banned again... chealsea away... Mourino says before the game it is a privaledge to have a team like LFC at stamford bridge, I have told my players just to watch and learn how to play. Liverpool score a hatful and stay at the top of the table...

Does that sound better?? I too would like to live in "your world" and see life through red tinted glasses but lets get real for the last 5 years we have been getting further and further behind the top clubs. Its not going to be corrected in 7 games...

Lets get behind our great club and behind who I think is a great manager (and most of you where singing his praises only a couple of games away) and show united support. this transition may take months to start to come together. I personally think it may take seasons to sort out the problems that Mr Benitez is currently faced with.. let hope I'm wrong.. Walk on, with hope in our hearts!!!

by **barnesrush** » Mon Oct 04, 2004 5:21 pm

spot on ola. last time i came on this site was after the monaco game so you can imagine how unbelievably fickle and shortsighted these posts look to me. time is a great healer and two defeats against top class opposition (and a tricky away tie in europe with a change in tactics) doesnt take you from potential champions league winners to lower half of the table strugglers.

by **Ola Mr Benitez** » Mon Oct 04, 2004 9:34 pm

thanks... fickle is the word

by **A.B.** » Mon Oct 04, 2004 9:46 pm

What you gonna do start supporting someone else

You have a hard time understanding things. If I am not a Liverpool fan I'm not a fan of football period. You understand what I'm saying? Liverpool is FOOTBALL to me. How can I support another club when I just said that Liverpool is the reason why I love football? I wouldn't love football if I was a fan of another club.

then you're not a real fan then.

you may not like what you're seeing at the moment but you don't lose your "love of the club". believe me mate nobody's p#ssed of more than me that we haven't won the league since 1990 but i love the club and always will.

walk on

I respect you StMichael but read what I just told Taff, maybe you will understand it better.

Leon,****** off buddy. I don't like explaining things that I have already explained so you're going to have to look at my previous posts.

by **laza** » Tue Oct 05, 2004 2:45 pm

Well said Ola, while understand MB forum is always going to be a bit of yoyo comments wise.
Some of the stuff written goes way past kneejerk straight after loss frustrations

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