Liverpool FC Forum

by **aCe'** » Thu Sep 16, 2010 2:00 pm

Benny The Noon wrote:Just because I'm not happy with what I am seeing on the pitch and about certain transfers doesn't mean I don't want us to improve or be successful . Half the problem on the Hodgson thread comes from you trying to start a flame war any time someone posts something you don't agree with - how about actually debating the points that people are posting instead or trying to wind everyone up - people are fully entitled to critisize the manager and just because they do it doesn't make them any less of fan and it doesn't mean they don't want us to be successful - this board is becoming more political and less about the football .

Benny, I criticize Roy whenever i feel it's warranted .. Thats totally besides the point though...

The real issue is when you have people using unwarranted criticism to push their agenda through.. To try and reiterate what they consider to be the fact that Benitez would have been a better bet for Liverpool this season despite his failings..

What really gets to me is that its never worded as such... People try to be smart about their digs and its obvious as fck..

I never liked Lando but atm i find him way more tolerable than most of the others down here who stick behind the whole 'we support the manager, let the Bentiez thing go' and then bring his time up at every other opportunity..

by **Benny The Noon** » Thu Sep 16, 2010 2:02 pm

Please show me what c.rap I have aimed at Hodgson . So does that mean if your are critical of someone that means you don't want them to succeed - I have supported Liverpool for 30 years now and I have not once ever wanted to fail - I don't care who the manager is as long as they make us successful

by **Benny The Noon** » Thu Sep 16, 2010 2:05 pm

aCe' wrote:
Benny The Noon wrote:Just because I'm not happy with what I am seeing on the pitch and about certain transfers doesn't mean I don't want us to improve or be successful . Half the problem on the Hodgson thread comes from you trying to start a flame war any time someone posts something you don't agree with - how about actually debating the points that people are posting instead or trying to wind everyone up - people are fully entitled to critisize the manager and just because they do it doesn't make them any less of fan and it doesn't mean they don't want us to be successful - this board is becoming more political and less about the football .

Benny, I criticize Roy whenever i feel it's warranted .. Thats totally besides the point though...

The real issue is when you have people using unwarranted criticism to push their agenda through.. To try and reiterate what they consider to be the fact that Benitez would have been a better bet for Liverpool this season despite his failings..

What really gets to me is that its never worded as such... People try to be smart about their digs and its obvious as fck..

I never liked Lando but atm i find him way more tolerable than most of the others down here who stick behind the whole 'we support the manager, let the Bentiez thing go' and then bring his time up at every other opportunity..

Ace I fully accept and realise Benitez is gone and it's all about now and the future not what went on last season - Rafa has his chance and it didn't work out , Hodgson is the manager now and its up to him to move us forward . It seems people constantly bring up last season in some way to constantly show Hodgson in a more favourable light .

by **bigmick** » Thu Sep 16, 2010 3:23 pm

As the thread looks like it's been successfully derailed, intentionally or otherwise, I'm going to make an attempt to bring it back into some sort of line.

As I said earlier, the point is really that if you accept (as I definately do, it hurts but you can't seriously debate it) that we have no chance whatsoever of winning the title, then all of a sudden you look upon our results in a completely different light. Now I know there will be some who say (infact some already have) that it's a question of goalpost moving, but whatever you call it it is the reality.

Given all of that, tonights game is for me very important for a number of reasons. Firstly, it would be nice to win something and it ain't going to be the league. Secondly, there's going to be a number of people playing who we really could do with putting in a performance, because we are going to need them in the league.

In no particular order, the ones who spring to mind are:

Konchesky- He is obviously going to eb our first choice left back, and as such it's in all our interests if he's quite good. He started pretty well against Brum, but then again everyone else being pretty sh!t probably made him look better than he was. He needs to build on that tonight if he plays (he probably won't I shouldn't think).

Mereiles- I'm left in two mids about him after his 15 minute cameo. I might be pro Roy, but I am also not afraid of calling it early and if he plays tonight, I'm hoping to get a good read on him. Obvously hopefully he isn't another Aquilani, but there were a couple of worrying signs against Brum. We REALLY need this lad to come through.

Cole-He's had a few weeks off, and we need him back and firing. Mainly so we can either break off the Lucas/Poulsen axis, or alternatively so we can someone playing on whichever flank you choose who is actually a good player.

Agger-Surely he's better than Skyrtel, time to prove it.

Ryan Babel-At some point, even if we're going to sell him, he has to play so we can get some decent money for him. Is it possible that it could just suddenly click for him? Prolly not but you never know I suppose.

Christian Poulsen-Some don't rate him, I do. Time to prove me right

by **Igor Zidane** » Thu Sep 16, 2010 3:34 pm

bigmick wrote:As the thread looks like it's been successfully derailed, intentionally or otherwise, I'm going to make an attempt to bring it back into some sort of line.

As I said earlier, the point is really that if you accept (as I definately do, it hurts but you can't seriously debate it) that we have no chance whatsoever of winning the title, then all of a sudden you look upon our results in a completely different light. Now I know there will be some who say (infact some already have) that it's a question of goalpost moving, but whatever you call it it is the reality.

Given all of that, tonights game is for me very important for a number of reasons. Firstly, it would be nice to win something and it ain't going to be the league. Secondly, there's going to be a number of people playing who we really could do with putting in a performance, because we are going to need them in the league.

In no particular order, the ones who spring to mind are:

Konchesky- He is obviously going to eb our first choice left back, and as such it's in all our interests if he's quite good. He started pretty well against Brum, but then again everyone else being pretty sh!t probably made him look better than he was. He needs to build on that tonight if he plays (he probably won't I shouldn't think).

Mereiles- I'm left in two mids about him after his 15 minute cameo. I might be pro Roy, but I am also not afraid of calling it early and if he plays tonight, I'm hoping to get a good read on him. Obvously hopefully he isn't another Aquilani, but there were a couple of worrying signs against Brum. We REALLY need this lad to come through.

Cole-He's had a few weeks off, and we need him back and firing. Mainly so we can either break off the Lucas/Poulsen axis, or alternatively so we can someone playing on whichever flank you choose who is actually a good player.

Agger-Surely he's better than Skyrtel, time to prove it.

Ryan Babel-At some point, even if we're going to sell him, he has to play so we can get some decent money for him. Is it possible that it could just suddenly click for him? Prolly not but you never know I suppose.

Christian Poulsen-Some don't rate him, I do. Time to prove me right

Don't think poulson is playing tonight mick or lucas for that matter . From what i heard it's a spearing mereiles partnership . Good post by the way .

I'm not trying to be arguementative or anything but i'd rather we were not in this comp tbh . For the same reason's as last year . I think we need to put all our eggs into finishing in the top four basket . We don't need destractions or possibilities of our players getting tired or injured . I'd play as many of the squad players as possible and leave our first team to concentrate on the league .

by **Scottbot** » Thu Sep 16, 2010 3:42 pm

Igor Zidane wrote:I'm not trying to be arguementative or anything but i'd rather we were not in this comp tbh . For the same reason's as last year . I think we need to put all our eggs into finishing in the top four basket . We don't need destractions or possibilities of our players getting tired or injured . I'd play as many of the squad players as possible and leave our first team to concentrate on the league .

Encouraging to hear Hodgson say he will use this tournament and the League to use the squad and evaluate some of our younger players though. Hopefully it will become a bit of a forum to properly blood the likes of Pachecho, shelvey and Johnson now that we have qualified for the group stage.

by **Scottbot** » Thu Sep 16, 2010 3:44 pm

Just looked back over this thread and it looks like congratulations for another collective derailment! :buttrock

by **bigmick** » Thu Sep 16, 2010 3:53 pm

Igor Zidane wrote:I'm not trying to be arguementative or anything but i'd rather we were not in this comp tbh . For the same reason's as last year . I think we need to put all our eggs into finishing in the top four basket . We don't need destractions or possibilities of our players getting tired or injured . I'd play as many of the squad players as possible and leave our first team to concentrate on the league .

I know what you mean mate, but I think as long as the focus is right then we can use it to our benefit. I'm actually surprised nobody has got after me for the amount Roy is rotating, particularly given how against I was when his predecessor did it. It hasn't surprised me (I actually said that those who thought Roy would keep the same team every match were miles off) but the scale of it has a bit.

The good thing is though, for me it's the right way around. It definately appears that we are resting players in Europe so they are available in the league, or using players in Europe so they'll be fit for the league, as opposed to the other way around.

Mereiles and Cole for example are definately going to benefit hugely from playing tonight, as in Konchesky. That is "benefit" as in we benefit, the first team in the league. As such, while it is a bit of a b0ll0cks competition, for now it suits us to be in it IMHO.

by **Benny The Noon** » Thu Sep 16, 2010 4:38 pm

bigmick wrote:As the thread looks like it's been successfully derailed, intentionally or otherwise, I'm going to make an attempt to bring it back into some sort of line.

As I said earlier, the point is really that if you accept (as I definately do, it hurts but you can't seriously debate it) that we have no chance whatsoever of winning the title, then all of a sudden you look upon our results in a completely different light. Now I know there will be some who say (infact some already have) that it's a question of goalpost moving, but whatever you call it it is the reality.

Given all of that, tonights game is for me very important for a number of reasons. Firstly, it would be nice to win something and it ain't going to be the league. Secondly, there's going to be a number of people playing who we really could do with putting in a performance, because we are going to need them in the league.

In no particular order, the ones who spring to mind are:

Konchesky- He is obviously going to eb our first choice left back, and as such it's in all our interests if he's quite good. He started pretty well against Brum, but then again everyone else being pretty sh!t probably made him look better than he was. He needs to build on that tonight if he plays (he probably won't I shouldn't think).

Mereiles- I'm left in two mids about him after his 15 minute cameo. I might be pro Roy, but I am also not afraid of calling it early and if he plays tonight, I'm hoping to get a good read on him. Obvously hopefully he isn't another Aquilani, but there were a couple of worrying signs against Brum. We REALLY need this lad to come through.

Cole-He's had a few weeks off, and we need him back and firing. Mainly so we can either break off the Lucas/Poulsen axis, or alternatively so we can someone playing on whichever flank you choose who is actually a good player.

Agger-Surely he's better than Skyrtel, time to prove it.

Ryan Babel-At some point, even if we're going to sell him, he has to play so we can get some decent money for him. Is it possible that it could just suddenly click for him? Prolly not but you never know I suppose.

Christian Poulsen-Some don't rate him, I do. Time to prove me right

I think its important as hopefully a win will give the lads a bit more confidence and hopefully get the ball rolling with a good run of performances and wins .

Konchesky - Was solid on his debut and its starting to look liek i got to admit i was wrong about him - only thing that worried me was the amount of crosses coming from his area - needs to close them down a bit quicker

Merieles is a totally different player to Aquilani - more combative, more robust , more box to box midfielder a midfielder more in the gerrard of old type role - not sure what has you worried from sunday about him ?

Cole - needs to justify the hype surrounding his arrival - needs to create and score goals - tonight would be a great start

Agger- no idea why he isnt playing instead of skrtel - its an awful choice to have him on the bench and skrtel playing

Babel - is this is 6th or 7th last chance now ?! he has to do it now or never - hodgson tried to offload him in the summer so i got a feeling he may try again in jan

Poulsen - well you know my view on him - never going to be good enough in the prem - too rigid , no energy , no mobility and its sticking out like a sore thumb at the moment .

by **maguskwt** » Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:05 am

Scottbot wrote:Just looked back over this thread and it looks like congratulations for another collective derailment!

To be fair it wasn't Benny who derailed it. Like everytime, he posts his opinions without any abuse and all of a sudden 3/4 posters are at him like Piranhas to meat.

by **PabloMedina28** » Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:14 am

Well finish 3rd

by **maguskwt** » Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:15 am

There was an ancient saying I believe, aim for the stars and you'll hit the moon. And that's ok because some don't even aim for anything. If we set the stall out to finish 4th place, we're not gonna get it.

I actually agree with what Lakes just posted. It's the most sensible post on this thread. I believe what we should be doing is win against all 'lesser'/'smaller' teams. If we can do that we'll be ok. That doesn't mean that we should not try to win against our rivals, we should try to win every game. But it we can consistently beat the smaller teams we don't need to beat the bigger teams. If we draw against smaller teams, I would feel like we've lost.

This is what I believe Rafa's biggest weakness was... Roy shouldn't be repeating it.

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