Liverpool FC Forum

by **steviec** » Fri Apr 23, 2010 9:23 pm

The commentators seemed to take it for granted that we will walk over Madrid at Anfield. Who the hell is gonna score the goals needed. Ngog spent most of the game on his *rse, useless, feckin useless, and he has no pace, don't know what Rafa sees in him.

by **steviec** » Fri Apr 23, 2010 9:24 pm

we are now a worse team than when Rafa took over:angry:

by **Sabre** » Fri Apr 23, 2010 9:35 pm

Thanks to reg I was able to be there. Yes, I know, the football of our side wasn't good, but for me it was great to be there. Talking to the Liverpool reds before the game was great, being able to watch the part of the pitch I wanted to look and not what the tv showed me, that is, enjoying a Liverpool game in the stadium is something that makes crossing half of Spain in car well worthy.

I met many reds, and thanks to the training on this site I was more than able to translate stuff between them and Atletico fans. Hilarious it was to see an Scouse trying to invite to an old atletico to a "bevvy" (he had 80 years or so), and I had to explain the kind scouse that the man refused because of heart disease, but the scouse said it can't be bad to the heart

The same lads were giving Don't Buy the Sun stickies to everyone in the bar, it was an honour to me to explain the Spaniards there what those stickies meant. The Scouses were happy when they met this Spanish red, but when I told them I'm a Spirit Shankly member, they found it unbelievable :laugh:

but they liked that too.

It caught my attention the age of many reds. Pretty veteran reds I found over there, Spanish fans do not travel that much when they get that age. An Scouse told me travelling is expensive and that's why you don't get to see many 21 year olders.

I watched the match in a privileged zone, which I'm not used to it (I usually watch games in the cheap tickets around here). I was surrounded by atletico fans, and they didn't like too much I protested the bóllocks they were spouting, but the most depressing thing was to sing alone the few times I could hear our side's supporters.

The game? it was a bad effort against a decent Atletico side. It was depressing too, because Atletico, no matter how easy you think it is to win there, is a team that in a cup competition they give their best. And to counter them we had Lucas and Ngog. It was depressing because even a firm believer of this team as I am saw that our team's quality these days is too average in some positions. And if you lose a battle in the midfield against two quality guys like Raul Garcia and Assunsao, that means Gerrard won't be activated, and that means you can consider yourself lucky to get out from there with one goal of difference, even if the one of Benayoun should have counted.

The reds were well depressed after our game, and of course, I talked with them about Rafa. All of them loved Rafa, nobody of them mocked him as we can read here sometimes, but I could see the doubt in their eyes. Some of them talked about having to support him, but all of them admitted that something is not definitely working. I found some reds that were very critic with the average players that play surrounding Gerrard too, I saw low morale.

But I saw a game of a great club, with great supporters, and I left Madrid knowing this was just an awful season, Liverpool will come back. I also came back with a eternal gratitude to Reg, real fans may have low expectations, but are more than able to make a Spaniard from San Sebastian happy.

I didn't take any photos, my mate did for me (I wanted to focus in the game and the experience), so as soon as he passes me the photos I commanded him to do, I will share them here to comment.

by **tonyeh** » Fri Apr 23, 2010 9:41 pm

Nice story Sabre.

by **fivecups** » Fri Apr 23, 2010 10:46 pm

Feckin' magic Sabre dude !!!!!!!!

:buttrock

by **red37** » Fri Apr 23, 2010 11:44 pm

Great to hear of your adventure!

by **LFC2007** » Sat Apr 24, 2010 2:24 am

Nice one sabre! Glad you took something positive from it

by **Bad Bob** » Sat Apr 24, 2010 3:52 am

Sabre wrote:Thanks to reg I was able to be there. Yes, I know, the football of our side wasn't good, but for me it was great to be there. Talking to the Liverpool reds before the game was great, being able to watch the part of the pitch I wanted to look and not what the tv showed me, that is, enjoying a Liverpool game in the stadium is something that makes crossing half of Spain in car well worthy.

I met many reds, and thanks to the training on this site I was more than able to translate stuff between them and Atletico fans. Hilarious it was to see an Scouse trying to invite to an old atletico to a "bevvy" (he had 80 years or so), and I had to explain the kind scouse that the man refused because of heart disease, but the scouse said it can't be bad to the heart

The same lads were giving Don't Buy the Sun stickies to everyone in the bar, it was an honour to me to explain the Spaniards there what those stickies meant. The Scouses were happy when they met this Spanish red, but when I told them I'm a Spirit Shankly member, they found it unbelievable but they liked that too.

It caught my attention the age of many reds. Pretty veteran reds I found over there, Spanish fans do not travel that much when they get that age. An Scouse told me travelling is expensive and that's why you don't get to see many 21 year olders.

I watched the match in a privileged zone, which I'm not used to it (I usually watch games in the cheap tickets around here). I was surrounded by atletico fans, and they didn't like too much I protested the bóllocks they were spouting, but the most depressing thing was to sing alone the few times I could hear our side's supporters.

The game? it was a bad effort against a decent Atletico side. It was depressing too, because Atletico, no matter how easy you think it is to win there, is a team that in a cup competition they give their best. And to counter them we had Lucas and Ngog. It was depressing because even a firm believer of this team as I am saw that our team's quality these days is too average in some positions. And if you lose a battle in the midfield against two quality guys like Raul Garcia and Assunsao, that means Gerrard won't be activated, and that means you can consider yourself lucky to get out from there with one goal of difference, even if the one of Benayoun should have counted.

The reds were well depressed after our game, and of course, I talked with them about Rafa. All of them loved Rafa, nobody of them mocked him as we can read here sometimes, but I could see the doubt in their eyes. Some of them talked about having to support him, but all of them admitted that something is not definitely working. I found some reds that were very critic with the average players that play surrounding Gerrard too, I saw low morale.

But I saw a game of a great club, with great supporters, and I left Madrid knowing this was just an awful season, Liverpool will come back. I also came back with a eternal gratitude to Reg, real fans may have low expectations, but are more than able to make a Spaniard from San Sebastian happy.

I didn't take any photos, my mate did for me (I wanted to focus in the game and the experience), so as soon as he passes me the photos I commanded him to do, I will share them here to comment.

Great to hear about your experiences, mate, and the bolded bit was especially interesting to read. I think it tells its own story.

by **laza** » Sat Apr 24, 2010 6:47 am

Boocity wrote:
ironman wrote:No Champions league football for our club is a disaster, the thought of it depresses me personally...

Me too

I more depressed about Thursday night Europa games fornicating up our league campaign next year tbh

by **Owzat** » Sat Apr 24, 2010 8:39 am

Boocity wrote:
ironman wrote:No Champions league football for our club is a disaster, the thought of it depresses me personally...

Me too

I'm not so depressed at the prospect of no CL football, more the fact we'll be playing EDL football instead and face Monday and Thursday nights which are the hellhole slots of football.

The problem with CL for me is the need to progress for money's sake, to keep our status high without a serious prospect of winning it - no more than a handful of other clubs are. It hinders our league form, the manager won't freely admit it but most of us know he always has an upcoming CL fixture in mind, you can see it in selections and substitutions. But at the moment, with MAYBE last season as an exception, we're happy finishing top four and "doing well" in the CL and that's not a winning mentality.

The difference between CL and domestic cups is not just in prestige, but noone gives two sh[i]i[/]ts if we don't progress in the FA Cup or League Cup, but if we do badly in the CL it is seen as abject failure. With the league we adjust our expectations according to our start or current status, we hung on to hopes or expectations of fourth once it was clear we wouldn't win the league, but should we be adjusting our expectations?!?! I think anything lower than third is not good enough, never has been, but since fourth now comes with a big red ribbon tied round it ie the fourth CL spot, people seem to accept it.

Last time any side outside the top three went on to win the league title the following season was Leeds back in 91/92 having finished fourth in 90/91.

Here's some more recent Champions, I've excluded Chelsea (money) and Man Utd (dominant) and included only sides who don't or didn't win that often.

Leeds Utd - 4th in 90/91 (68 points), Champions in 91/92 (82 points)

Blackburn - 2nd in 93/94 (84 points), Champions in 94/95 (89 points)

Arsenal* - 3rd in 96/97 (68 points), Champions in 97/98 (78 points) and 6th in 87/88 (66 points), Champions in 88/89 (76 points)

Bitters - 7th in 83/84 (62 points), Champions in 84/85 (90 points) - finished 19th, 15th, 8th and 7th from 79/80 to 82/83)

Remarkably Arsenal finished as low as 12th in 94/95 and won the league title just three seasons later. Wenger never seems to get the credit he deserves, with all the obstacles he faced including taking over a faltering Arsenal side, having not nearly as much money as others and quite often selling off his best players. Yet the last time they finished outside the top four was 95/96.

As I've mentioned a few times in the past day or two, you can't really compare eras so this is purely of interest. It is much harder to jump from outside the top two and be champions the next season, only twice have teams won the title from third in the Premiership - Arsenal in 97/98 and Man Utd in 02/03. Chelsea would become only the third side in the Premiership to finish third one season and win it the following season, come on Chelsea! (or Arsenal would be the first to do it from fourth.......................)

by **Owzat** » Sat Apr 24, 2010 8:54 am

Bad Bob wrote:
Sabre wrote:The reds were well depressed after our game, and of course, I talked with them about Rafa. All of them loved Rafa, nobody of them mocked him as we can read here sometimes, but I could see the doubt in their eyes. Some of them talked about having to support him, but all of them admitted that something is not definitely working. I found some reds that were very critic with the average players that play surrounding Gerrard too, I saw low morale.

Great to hear about your experiences, mate, and the bolded bit was especially interesting to read. I think it tells its own story.

I prefer it when fans make their own minds up rather than decide they have to back the manager, or be seen to be backing the manager - or act as a group. They can always abstain ie not boo, not chant his name. For me giving him the impression everyone is backing him 100% is completely wrong, is it for his benefit or for neutrals/detractors?!? The manager must know the 'support' is a gesture, the media are on his back and for good reason. For all those supporting the manager know he could be looking elsewhere, he'll know better than anyone chanting his name what he has in mind and if he is considering a move to a big club abroad. If he really loved this club then maybe he'd have walked already, but I think he thinks he is still able to do a good job and sometimes a desire to succeed can lead someone to make too many wrong decisions. I think Houllier planned to much for the future and not enough for the immediate present (back then)

As for the club tradition of not sacking managers, well I say it's a nice record of sorts, but frankly if the time is right then the manager should go and if they won't go by mutual agreement or walk then the club has to do/take what is left

Of course fans have doubts, how can they not?!? While last season may not have returned a trophy, it did lift expectations perhaps as high as they've been since King Kenny left, and we face an embarrassing league finish, possibly no trophy or perhaps the tin pot EDL trophy which some think compares to the UEFA Cup while others realise that the top sides aren't in it so it may as well be sponsored by LDV or Johnstone's Paints :Oo:

We'd have beaten one side you might consider a top side, even then that would only be Atletico who bombed out of CL same as us - albeit they had a relatively tough group containing Porto and Chelsea, but have got beyond the last 16 since 96/97 (QF)

by **red37** » Sat Apr 24, 2010 11:39 am

Title edit.

May as well keep this as one general Semi-Final thread....Last chance to push for a stab at some Silverware for the team on Thursday at Anfield - lets get behind every one of them.

Hamburg is a great city to visit. The ale is of particularly high quality btw!

Best of luck Redmen, its going to be tough....but in adversity - 'character' and 'experience' are both augmented. Get at them from the offf and don't allow Atletico time on the ball - lets really go for it!

by **bigmick** » Sat Apr 24, 2010 1:09 pm

Sabre wrote:Thanks to reg I was able to be there. Yes, I know, the football of our side wasn't good, but for me it was great to be there. Talking to the Liverpool reds before the game was great, being able to watch the part of the pitch I wanted to look and not what the tv showed me, that is, enjoying a Liverpool game in the stadium is something that makes crossing half of Spain in car well worthy.

I met many reds, and thanks to the training on this site I was more than able to translate stuff between them and Atletico fans. Hilarious it was to see an Scouse trying to invite to an old atletico to a "bevvy" (he had 80 years or so), and I had to explain the kind scouse that the man refused because of heart disease, but the scouse said it can't be bad to the heart

The same lads were giving Don't Buy the Sun stickies to everyone in the bar, it was an honour to me to explain the Spaniards there what those stickies meant. The Scouses were happy when they met this Spanish red, but when I told them I'm a Spirit Shankly member, they found it unbelievable but they liked that too.

It caught my attention the age of many reds. Pretty veteran reds I found over there, Spanish fans do not travel that much when they get that age. An Scouse told me travelling is expensive and that's why you don't get to see many 21 year olders.

I watched the match in a privileged zone, which I'm not used to it (I usually watch games in the cheap tickets around here). I was surrounded by atletico fans, and they didn't like too much I protested the bóllocks they were spouting, but the most depressing thing was to sing alone the few times I could hear our side's supporters.

The game? it was a bad effort against a decent Atletico side. It was depressing too, because Atletico, no matter how easy you think it is to win there, is a team that in a cup competition they give their best. And to counter them we had Lucas and Ngog. It was depressing because even a firm believer of this team as I am saw that our team's quality these days is too average in some positions. And if you lose a battle in the midfield against two quality guys like Raul Garcia and Assunsao, that means Gerrard won't be activated, and that means you can consider yourself lucky to get out from there with one goal of difference, even if the one of Benayoun should have counted.

The reds were well depressed after our game, and of course, I talked with them about Rafa. All of them loved Rafa, nobody of them mocked him as we can read here sometimes, but I could see the doubt in their eyes. Some of them talked about having to support him, but all of them admitted that something is not definitely working. I found some reds that were very critic with the average players that play surrounding Gerrard too, I saw low morale.

But I saw a game of a great club, with great supporters, and I left Madrid knowing this was just an awful season, Liverpool will come back. I also came back with a eternal gratitude to Reg, real fans may have low expectations, but are more than able to make a Spaniard from San Sebastian happy.

I didn't take any photos, my mate did for me (I wanted to focus in the game and the experience), so as soon as he passes me the photos I commanded him to do, I will share them here to comment.

Great read that Sabes, nice one.

by **J*o*n*D*o*e** » Sat Apr 24, 2010 1:21 pm

glad you had a good day Sabre just a pity about the result.

by **Kharhaz** » Sun Apr 25, 2010 1:01 am

Sabre wrote:The same lads were giving Don't Buy the Sun stickies to everyone in the bar, it was an honour to me to explain the Spaniards there what those stickies meant.

I didnt know the rag was sold over there. And if it isnt, it just proves what I have always said, by constantly mentioning them, and acknowledging they exist, its free publicity for them. Like the money raised for the blimp above anfield, all this is doing is pointing out to the world they are there.

For every "Dont buy the Sun" ad, you are advertising them and increasing there sales, STOP IT. They are scum, they are not worth mentioning. Stop giving them publicity. Anyone with a pure interest in Liverpool FC can look up the history for themself. They can learn for themself what has happened.

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