Liverpool FC Forum

[grayghost]

The main thing Liverpool need to do this season is compete to the end of the season not just the start if we finsh 4th but only 6to7 points of the top then  i would be happy that progress is being made. We can not alow ourselves to fall 20 points behind again that will not be alowed by the fans ur the owners now that a lot of time and money has been spent on this team pressure is on Rafa now.

On a second note i still belive we are 3 players away from a certain Title challenge.

[ivor_the_injun]

To go alongside the point I made earlier about me doubting that Shevchenko and Ballack will be as poor this season, likewise, I think it's important to say that it'll be incredibly difficult for us to perform quite so poorly away from home, so I see a significant points bump for us there from the off.

[grayghost]

We need 80to 85 points if we are gona challenge this season.

[Owzat]

The mancs won the league because they beat all but a few of the teams they should home and away. They lost twice to Arsenal, twice to West Ham and once I think to Portsmouth. They may have been lucky at times but they beat the teams we should have been beating. It's hard to say how many points are needed this season, I have a sneaky feeling it could be lower than previous seasons with so many clubs splashing the cash. Should make them harder to beat although the mancs have bought and bought players so many clubs turn up expecting to get beat.

We need goals, if we keep our defence tight enough and score more goals then we did last season then surely we have to be right in there. So a lot may depend on how Kuyt fares second season and Torres and Voronin.

[stmichael]

This thread actually takes me back to the days of Houllier and his proposed "five year plan". As far as I'm concerned Rafa has got two years at least to win the Premiership as long as we show signs of improvement this season and don't go backwards like we did last season.

Before Rafa joined, if someone had said that by the end of the season you'd have a third place finish and be only fifteen or so points behind the leaders... well, you'd have probably snapped their hand off. Our squad was in very bad shape - half of the miracle of Istanbul is the fact that Rafa pulled it off with loads of players who simply weren't good enough. It's largely down to Rafa that we're even mentioned in the context of a title challenge.

Usually a complete rebuild of a squad takes longer than four or five years. You have to get new players in, constrained by the clubs financial standing, and then you've got to get them playing together as a fully gelled team. English players are overpriced in the extreme, so we buy foreign... they're cheaper and can do just as good a job. Problem is, it generally takes a foreign player, unaccustomed to the Premier, anywhere from 6-12 months to 'bed in' properly. And we've been adding... what, six, seven players per window? Add to the fact that because of fixture congestion, these players will be rotated and won't start or even appear in every match, and that can hinder their acclimatisation. So we're constantly playing catch-up. Now that we have a very solid base to build from, we'll see new first-team signings reduced in number in the future, as we no longer have an entire squad to rebuild, which will help our League form as there is less disruption to the first team. You've seen the impact he's had, the steep increase in quality on the pitch, as he's been rebuilding an entire squad on a modest budget? Imagine what this bloke is going to be capable of when he starts fine-tuning the machine, aided by a fat wallet.

If Man U had worked with the concept of this 'five year plan for world domination', Slur Alex 'My Nose Looks Like Amir Khan's Speedball' Ferguson would not still be in charge of them. Seems to me that they reaped the rewards for sticking by their man.

We're Liverpool Football Club. And damn it, there should be some pressure on the gaffer to deliver the League title to our trophy cabinet. But because we've had Rafa at the helm for the last few years, this has become a realistic aim rather than nostalgia for the glory days. Let's not throw Teddy out of the pram if he doesn't bag us the title this coming season, as it will completely screw up our chances of winning it for the foreseeable future - a new manager will want a new squad, and the whole merry-go-round begins again.

[ivor_the_injun]

Avoiding injuries to key players will play a huge part this year.

Imagine Chelsea without Drogba and Lampard for a couple of months -  unless Shevchenko pulls his finger out, you struggle to see where the goals are coming from.

Without Ronaldo, Man U would be a different side altogether. They've already shown that they can cope with most of their defence sidelined, but what about if you take some of their attackers out of the equation. Rooney's great, but I feel like they can cope without him for a spell. Can you say the same about Giggs and Scholes though?

For us, last season Kewell was almost permanently absent, Garcia and Aurelio were long term absentees, and we were blunt on the left constantly as a result. After our appalling start, that just killed us. If we can keep every position adequately covered this season, it could make the difference. We've had to patch sides together far too much in recent years.

It's a real lottery, but I do think that one long term injury can make or break the season for the teams at the top, and equally that we're due the cards to fall our way for a change.

[ivor_the_injun]

We're Liverpool Football Club. And damn it, there should be some pressure on the gaffer to deliver the League title to our trophy cabinet. But because we've had Rafa at the helm for the last few years, this has become a realistic aim rather than nostalgia for the glory days. Let's not throw Teddy out of the pram if he doesn't bag us the title this coming season, as it will completely screw up our chances of winning it for the foreseeable future - a new manager will want a new squad, and the whole merry-go-round begins again.

Excellent post. It has been all too easy for many to get caught up with the idea that we now have money and so should just be able to buy the league.

Chelsea and Man U have had the kind of money we've spent this summer available to them for the last 3 or 4 seasons, and there's no player out there that they couldn't outbid us for if they really wanted to.

I think the new stadium is the key to everything that the Meerkans have got planned, and that anything we achieve before then is a bonus. We've got to two CL finals in three years with squads that probably shouldn't have done. Rafa has made the players he's had overachieve on the European stage (remember that we've had players like Smicer, Zenden and Traore featuring in the finals), but it's only now that we're getting even close to the kind of squad that looks capable of getting through a league season competitively. The Prem is another matter entirely, and to expect us to jump two places using one transfer window is pretty ludicrous.

None of our rivals are weaker going into the new season, and we're yet to see how the likes of Torres and Babel fare against physical teams such as Bolton and Reading, let alone against the big guns. There's still a lot of work to be done, but I do like the look of the way we're going about it so far.

[grayghost]

In almost all the news tabloids Liverpool have been wrongly quoted haveing spent 40 odd million this close season putting us up there with the big spenders Manu * Chelsia and even Spurs. But we have not. Only 20 million has been spent and that only amounts to 1 player in the top 2 teams not even that if Man u get Tevez. So why the extra pressure this season from the from the media it rearly ticks me off when people try to say Liverpool are trying to buy the Prem. we have only rearly paid to buy 1 player this season and that is Torres the rest we paid for with the money from certain player sales. Why are we so much better now is vorin as good as Cisse is Yossi as good as Garcia Is Babel as good as bellamy i don't now so why are we suddenky the favs to bridge the gap between the top 2 because i belive spurs are in just as good as position as us with the squad they have. we still need 3 top class players for a title challenge this season.

[The_Rock]

I just can't see us winning the league. We are still lack "cutting edge" in our attacking play.....

I mean manure and arsenal can cut open teams.

Drogba can singlehandedly cause problems for the opposition defenders and players like lampard exploit this to score lots of goals for chelsea.

We seem to lack this in our attacking play (from what i have seen from our attacking players so far).

But we should at least get 3rd this season..... and win the league and FA cup. This will then qualify as a good season (so...rafa is safe  )....

[Wilhelmsson]

There have been a lot of good points made in this topic and since I share a proportion of them I shall keep my post short.

G&H seem to love Rafa, they lavish praise onto Rafa at every media opportunity that is presented in their direction. G&H have proven this by backing Rafa where it really matters and that’s in the transfer market.

Rafa’s managerial seat is well and truly secured IMO; the board know how talented Rafa is as a manager and will strive to keep him in charge for the foreseeable future. This admiration and support for Rafa is distributed equally through all sections of the club.

Has anyone else noticed that  the level of euphoria around the pre-season and the level of expectation amongst supporters and the media alike has decreased from previous seasons? This will no doubt benefit Rafa, as the expectation is not to deliver the title, but is to improve further and get the team onto a level whereby there is a sustained challenge through the nine or so months of the Premiership.

I’d like to see an improvement in results on the whole, against MU and Chelsea and in particular away from home.

I’d like to see more variety in the team’s play, instead of implementing the same build up and attacking play, I’d like to see more different and contrasting styles of build up play introduced into the overall game.

If one attack fails to break down a team, I’d like to see a different style of attacking being introduced; I’d like to see the team dictate the tempo of play more often.

What I want to see is a higher essence of individual creative freedom. I’d like to see Kuyt playing further up and getting into the box more often, I’d like to see Alonso push further up.

Lastly, I’d like better finishing from our strikers in particular, but from the team as a collective. The more chances the team put away, the higher chance of winning the match, the higher chance of gaining more points etc.

If this is met this season then I will be satisfied and content, if any trophies make their way back to Anfield, then this will be a bonus IMO.

[stmichael]

In all fairness to Rafa, we're quite lucky this season in that the first 10 or so games should yield a lot of points; in fact we should be looking at maximum points from those teams (even Chelsea at home- we've shown many times over the last 2 seasons that we can beat them at Anfield- we have to do it again). If we get the ball rolling, we can take the momentum right the way through the big games, and hopefully through the Christmas/New Year period.

[lakes10]

In all fairness to Rafa, we're quite lucky this season in that the first 10 or so games should yield a lot of points; in fact we should be looking at maximum points from those teams (even Chelsea at home- we've shown many times over the last 2 seasons that we can beat them at Anfield- we have to do it again). If we get the ball rolling, we can take the momentum right the way through the big games, and hopefully through the Christmas/New Year period.

You are right, for the first time in some year we have the chance to build up a good winning run before we get to the hard games.
What i still dont think we have got is away to beat the teams that just sit back for 90min in thieir own half. I always said that pace could beat teams like that but they even seem to stop that. the other top 3 teams seem to get the 1 goal to get the win were we dont.

I get the feeling we we see a hell of a lot of long shots this year by the top 4 teams to overcome this.

[66-1112520797]

Football is as much a business today as it is a sport.

If a player hasnt produced, Rafa has no hesitation in shipping him out, same applies with the Spaniard himself. If he hasnt produced within a greater period of time than a player gets (and rightly so) I'd imagine and expect our owners to do the same thing with, lets just hope the latter doesnt happen and Rafa and the team produce.

[babu]

Football is as much a business today as it is a sport.

If a player hasnt produced, Rafa has no hesitation in shipping him out, same applies with the Spaniard himself. If he hasnt produced within a greater period of time than a player gets (and rightly so) I'd imagine and expect our owners to do the same thing with, lets just hope the latter doesnt happen and Rafa and the team produce.

What would you do with a striker that got you 25+ goals in his first season and directly responsible for a major trophy, second season got 20+ goals and a minor trophy, 3rd season 15+ but no trophy?

How many more season's would you give him? bearing in mind, he is young and highly regarded by european clubs?

Not a great analogy, but i don't think players and managers should be compared like that. just my IMO

[66-1112520797]

Football is as much a business today as it is a sport.

If a player hasnt produced, Rafa has no hesitation in shipping him out, same applies with the Spaniard himself. If he hasnt produced within a greater period of time than a player gets (and rightly so) I'd imagine and expect our owners to do the same thing with, lets just hope the latter doesnt happen and Rafa and the team produce.

What would you do with a striker that got you 25+ goals in his first season and directly responsible for a major trophy, second season got 20+ goals and a minor trophy, 3rd season 15+ but no trophy?

How many more season's would you give him? bearing in mind, he is young and highly regarded by european clubs?

Not a great analogy, but i don't think players and managers should be compared like that. just my IMO

Keep the striker he is proven.

For me Rafa has yet to prove his tactical nouse domesticly, we cant wait near enough a decade like the Mancs did with Fergie.

Not a great analogy, but i don't think players and managers should be compared like that. just my IMO

So how do you compare ? Well you probably dont need to.

But anyway, excuses will run out eventually and the CL win in 2005 cant keep him in a job here forever without the holy grail in toe.