Torres - He doesn't need a strike partner

Liverpool Football Club - General Discussion

Postby stmichael » Thu Jul 03, 2008 10:43 am

Scottbot wrote:Tonight proved me for me what i've figured for a while. That Torres  is FAR more effective when he plays upfront on his own. He was absolutely fantastic tonight and he played like the Torres we see week in week out for Liverpool. We are so lucky to have him. He was absolutely immense. It's so rare to get a forward who has the mobility, quickness, engine, skill, intelligence and work-rate to run an ENTIRE back four ragged all by HIMSELF. He ties up all four defenders at various stages of the game. He is so much better when he has the space to roam and doesn't have to worry about stepping on the toes of a strike partner. We are all talking about who to buy to complement him but really we need someone to come in and spell him.

it's a good post and just reaffirms that with better players around him he'll become even better which is frightening.

he played alone upfront for athletico madrid for years but the problem there was that they relied on him to do absolutely everything. he was their captain by the time he was eighteen and was getting very little support from those around him. here with the likes of babel, gerrard and hopefully a new wide player this season, we'll see him get even better.
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Postby jedi56 » Thu Jul 03, 2008 9:31 pm

torres does not need a strike partner but as a club planning future domination of the league...we need another torres. i love torres but he did not single handed get spain to the final,i seem to remember a prolific villa helping out. just like villa torres could get injured  and who will we have to carry the threat.

as for torres coming off for spain,i just think some refs don't like torres and never give him anything...prime example is against manu,or in the league cup when he was being battered by defenders and the ref allowed it...until gerard came on.  we can't have two strikers refs don't like the look of if nobody comes in for crouch.just like the crazy logic of raymond domenech using astrology to pick the french squad,i would watch tapes of all the top strikers and see which ones ref seem to like giving free kicks to.
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Postby NANNY RED » Thu Jul 03, 2008 10:03 pm

I believe him :nod

How can you not love the man. LEGAND

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Postby zarababe » Thu Jul 03, 2008 10:14 pm

Cool Nanny - he is a true star !

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EKoPLt_coFI&feature=related

Fernando Torres Liverpool's No 9 :)
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Postby LFC2007 » Thu Jul 03, 2008 11:34 pm

His goal against L'Allemagne was just immense, he assumed his natural position on the shoulder of the CB and initially it looked like it'd be a fairly routine job for the full back - keep body in front of the ball and clear. However, Torres' strength, desire, acceleration and balance prevailed, the finish was as natural as you'll see from a striker. Unbelievable goal.

Great vision, and positioning from Xavi as well btw, he saw that Frings was out of position and placed himself in the hole ready for the pivot and pass.


Re. the lone striker role and our style of play - I don't think our support play is currently good enough (it may change depending on who we sign, as well as other factors) for us to be successful throughout the season. It was successful enough in the last part of the season, but against quality defenders it's much tougher, and against top teams Torres finds himself fighting a losing battle due to a lack of support. When good defenders become aware of the main threat i.e. Gerrard/Torres, we need other players to help out - to create space, to play cute passes, and to score. Otherwise, over time, the threat becomes all the more predictable and easier to nulify. Two options would suffice, IMO, 1) Change to a 4-4-2, sign a nimble-footed forward who can turn on a sixpence, Arshavin or similar, to support Torres 2) Stick with the 4-5-1 and set about getting greater support from a number of areas. This means; i) Keep Alonso and purposefully instruct him to get forward more often, or ii) Sell him, sign Barry - who naturally gets forward more and supports the play. As a necessity to this option, we'd also need to sign a top quality winger who can support the play, create and score.

As an addendum to both options, at least one of our FB's has to support the play more often - Dossena by all accounts has a good engine and a cultured left peg.

It (playing with a lone striker) worked with Spain for the reason that their support play was excellent (but partly due to the fact that the German defence was sh!te). This relates to them playing in a 4-5-1, and a 4-4-2 - Throughout the tournament Iniesta, Xavi, Silva and Fabregas were more than prepared to assume threatening positions - making runs into the box, and if not scoring, then creating space for someone else. Unsettling defenders, and making it difficult to predict where the threat would come from.

FWIW, I don't think we currently have enough in our squad to support the play successfully. Kuyt on the right can hold the ball up well, get in positions to help others out, but in terms of posing a threat whilst supporting others, he fails. The support is there, the threat isn't (extent-wise), and just being there to pick it up isn't enough at the top level. Pennant despite being poor at holding up the ball, offers a bit more trickery, a more cultured cross, but poses little goal threat and doesn't get near the box.  On the left, Babel is threatening in open spaces, but in a typical game where defenders close down effectively - he's easily nulified, and he's never a left winger anyway.

In the FB positions, we have nobody who stands out. Most top teams have at least one high quality full back, we don't. Cole, Evra, Clichy - all much better than any of our FB's. All support the play very well.

In conclusion, our support play has to be much better, it has to pose a threat.
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Postby SundanceKid » Fri Jul 04, 2008 2:54 am

NANNY RED wrote:I believe him :nod

How can you not love the man. LEGAND

http://link.brightcove.com/service....0103022

I don't think I love my own father as much as that man. Even Stevie G himself wouldn't say something that promising.
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Postby LegBarnes » Fri Jul 04, 2008 4:20 am

Only thing better then torres is 2 torres and i can see that happening stay 4-2-3-1 let the lad dominate agian this season.

Torres is for me so good now rafa should look to build team around him gerrard i love you too but you aint no torres  :D

On that note mabye now gerrard will lose this stigmar of a 1 man team and can focus now on playing football we might see him come into some top form well i hope so this is the season it really is COME ON YOU RED !

YNWA !   :buttrock
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Postby maguskwt » Fri Jul 04, 2008 4:32 am

thanks for the translations guys... 85 million pounds is alot of money and I'm sure our 2 very own american muppets would be twitching their fingers... they may be laying low now because of the mess they created for themselves and lest they alienate the fans even further (if that is possible) but who can guarantee that they will resist such an offer next summer?
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Postby SundanceKid » Fri Jul 04, 2008 8:43 pm

NANNY RED wrote:I believe him :nod

How can you not love the man. LEGAND

http://link.brightcove.com/service....0103022

I bookmarked this video and I watch it a couple of times a day. Did anyone notice the way he looked into the reporter's eyes?!
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Postby Sabre » Fri Jul 04, 2008 8:51 pm

NANNY RED wrote:I believe him :nod

How can you not love the man. LEGAND

http://link.brightcove.com/service....0103022

Is right.  :)
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Postby Kash_Mountain » Fri Jul 04, 2008 10:25 pm

Just watched that clip:

He is just Legend. No other player would be so confident to say such a thing. And yes, I beleive him.
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ABSOLUTE STRENGTH       

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Postby Reg » Fri Jul 04, 2008 11:47 pm

This lad is going nowhere............ fantastic.

July 5, 2008

Fernando Torres: Rafael Benitez pushed me to greatness

Few foreign players have adapted better - or as quickly - to the unique demands of top-flight football in England than Fernando Torres. In his first season, after arriving at Liverpool 12 months ago, he scored 33 goals in all competitions.

Yet as the prolific Spain striker ponders how he can improve next season, having set the bar so high, he is swift to pay tribute to the part that Rafael Benítez played in his rapid and spectacular progress. Without the intense guidance of the Liverpool manager, Torres maintains, he might not have made such an immediate impact.

“There are days when you think: ‘My God, this guy [Benítez] doesn't let you breathe',” Torres, a £20.2million buy from Atlético Madrid, said. “At times like that, you don't realise that all he wants is for you to improve.

“When you are in a team where things are going mostly well, players tend to relax. But you must always push yourself. Never become complacent; you try to do your best every single day. At a club like Liverpool, you can't sit back after scoring 20-odd goals and say: 'Well, that's it.' After you score 20, Benítez is at you during the next training session and stays on top of you all day, all week.

“He tells you to go off on your own and do new exercises. I want to progress in life, not relax, not be complacent, and you need someone close to you telling you to keep at it. It is impossible to do it otherwise. We don't always fancy someone that close but, in the long term, I am sure that everybody will thank him for it.”

Torres, 24, carried his form into the international arena this summer, scoring two goals as Spain were crowned European champions. His second goal - a trademark effort embracing power and pace - was enough to see off Germany 1-0 in the final in Vienna.

If Benítez's influence has been great, Torres has also reaped the benefit of playing alongside Steven Gerrard, the England midfield player. He has watched Gerrard closely - on and off the pitch - and used the Liverpool captain as an example of how to deal with life in the goldfish bowl that is Merseyside.

“I really admire Steven,” Torres said in an interview in Champions, the official magazine of the Uefa Champions League, said. “I know the pressure he is under every day, everybody talking about him all day long. In the changing-room, in the pubs, in the stadium. I've heard people say he should be stronger, have a stronger personality. I know by experience how difficult it is to deal with that because Liverpool is a huge club. And he's at another level, of course.

“People look at you from a distance and challenge you with their eyes. All that happens to Steve every day and he copes with it, everything that is expected of him all the time. He's always under tremendous pressure to perform and everyone looks to him to show leadership, to lift the team.

“He's a great example, and those of us who have been in a similar situation know how difficult it is to handle. It's incredible the way he carries himself regardless of what is going on around him. I'd love to be captain of another team one day and Steve has shown me how to be a great leader.”

During a career of many highs, Torres has had to endure his lows, too, particularly before his move to Anfield. He would turn to Olalla, his girlfriend, for sympathy and advice. “She has had to suffer much disappointed ranting and moaning, especially when I was at Atlético,” Torres said. “Now, she is also having a good time herself.

“She knows how to calm me down when I haven't been able to see the way out of the tunnel or wake me up when I've been sleeping. She pushes me when I need to be encouraged. The person that lives with you is sometimes the only one capable of helping you up when you don't realise how down you are.”
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Postby Bad Bob » Sat Jul 05, 2008 2:53 am

Reg wrote:This lad is going nowhere............ fantastic.

July 5, 2008

Fernando Torres: Rafael Benitez pushed me to greatness

Few foreign players have adapted better - or as quickly - to the unique demands of top-flight football in England than Fernando Torres. In his first season, after arriving at Liverpool 12 months ago, he scored 33 goals in all competitions.

Yet as the prolific Spain striker ponders how he can improve next season, having set the bar so high, he is swift to pay tribute to the part that Rafael Benítez played in his rapid and spectacular progress. Without the intense guidance of the Liverpool manager, Torres maintains, he might not have made such an immediate impact.

“There are days when you think: ‘My God, this guy [Benítez] doesn't let you breathe',” Torres, a £20.2million buy from Atlético Madrid, said. “At times like that, you don't realise that all he wants is for you to improve.

“When you are in a team where things are going mostly well, players tend to relax. But you must always push yourself. Never become complacent; you try to do your best every single day. At a club like Liverpool, you can't sit back after scoring 20-odd goals and say: 'Well, that's it.' After you score 20, Benítez is at you during the next training session and stays on top of you all day, all week.

“He tells you to go off on your own and do new exercises. I want to progress in life, not relax, not be complacent, and you need someone close to you telling you to keep at it. It is impossible to do it otherwise. We don't always fancy someone that close but, in the long term, I am sure that everybody will thank him for it.”

Torres, 24, carried his form into the international arena this summer, scoring two goals as Spain were crowned European champions. His second goal - a trademark effort embracing power and pace - was enough to see off Germany 1-0 in the final in Vienna.

If Benítez's influence has been great, Torres has also reaped the benefit of playing alongside Steven Gerrard, the England midfield player. He has watched Gerrard closely - on and off the pitch - and used the Liverpool captain as an example of how to deal with life in the goldfish bowl that is Merseyside.

“I really admire Steven,” Torres said in an interview in Champions, the official magazine of the Uefa Champions League, said. “I know the pressure he is under every day, everybody talking about him all day long. In the changing-room, in the pubs, in the stadium. I've heard people say he should be stronger, have a stronger personality. I know by experience how difficult it is to deal with that because Liverpool is a huge club. And he's at another level, of course.

“People look at you from a distance and challenge you with their eyes. All that happens to Steve every day and he copes with it, everything that is expected of him all the time. He's always under tremendous pressure to perform and everyone looks to him to show leadership, to lift the team.

“He's a great example, and those of us who have been in a similar situation know how difficult it is to handle. It's incredible the way he carries himself regardless of what is going on around him. I'd love to be captain of another team one day and Steve has shown me how to be a great leader.”

During a career of many highs, Torres has had to endure his lows, too, particularly before his move to Anfield. He would turn to Olalla, his girlfriend, for sympathy and advice. “She has had to suffer much disappointed ranting and moaning, especially when I was at Atlético,” Torres said. “Now, she is also having a good time herself.

“She knows how to calm me down when I haven't been able to see the way out of the tunnel or wake me up when I've been sleeping. She pushes me when I need to be encouraged. The person that lives with you is sometimes the only one capable of helping you up when you don't realise how down you are.”

This kid has got it completely, 100% together.  I'm absolutely made up he's a Red.  :bowdown
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Postby redsince2001 » Sat Jul 05, 2008 5:00 am

NANNY RED wrote:I believe him :nod

How can you not love the man. LEGAND

http://link.brightcove.com/service....0103022

i believe  :cool:
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Postby Alonso14 » Sat Jul 05, 2008 5:47 pm

The only thing that worries me is that he says:

"I'd love to be captain of another team one day and Steve has shown me how to be a great leader."

Probably just reading to far into it. I guess one day he would like to return home.
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