Liverpool FC Forum

[kazza]

insult me

Err ok

You seem to know more about cack than football probably because you see it after every date.

[GYBS]

And to think there were a couple of posters on here claiming he wasnt even injured.

He's picked up a strain at worst lad. They've released that statement for the element of suprise. If he's not on the bench for the mancs at least al be EXTREMELY suprised.

3 months MINIMUM with a torn hamstring. He wouldn't av walked off the pitch like he did either, am tellin ya.

Two and a half months MAXIMUM recovery time for a severe hamstring strain.

It isn't that severe otherwise he wouldn't have walked off, but going by the statement it could be 2 to 3 weeks, and for that reason I don't think he'll be risked at all for the Man U game.

Massive difference in a strain and a tear.

The article clearly says tear.

Its upto six months for a tear. Anyone who tells you otherwise is talking out there . If you come back too soon you will never recover as much as possible and you'll become weaker and prone to it.

Ever seen that one before?

No, 2 and a half months maximum then.

A tear can be a type of strain, i.e. a very small tear of the muscle fibres, that's why strains are often reported as tears.

A severe tear for a top athlete will typically not take up to sixth months to heal, it will take within two and a half months. However, it may take up to six months for a sunday league player (for example) who isn't as fit and doesn't have access to the best rehabilitation facilities, or someone who has other injuries which inhibit rehab, or if the tear is so severe that it requires surgery (rare).

A severe tear (which does need surgery) can take upto six months to heal properly. Once its "healed" it then needs to regain strength aswell. Once you've regained strength you then need to build up fitness.

The website clearly says it can take upto 3 months for the hamstring to heal. That doesn't include complete rehabilitation and the regaining of fitness levels and the required rest. It clearly states for the hamstring to heal, there are different grades of healing.

If you rush a hamstring injury, you become at great risk of being prone to it in the future. like Michael Owen. If you don't let the first one heal properly and keep getting them... they can affect your ability to run and also a players speed and agility... like Michael Owen. It can then hinder you as a player and cause other injuries. like Michael Owen.

The fact you say a Sunday league player would be out for longer with the same injury shows a complete and utter lack of knowledge... granted professionals have physio's but so does anyone else... professional's are on a different planet altogether when it comes to injuries and fitness.

They get nailed on nearly every tackle, they use explosive pace and play against explosive players and they have to be 100% at all times. Sunday league players don't, not even close.

Professional's twist an ankle on Sunday and the chances are they will miss a Wednesday game through not being fit enough. They lose a hell of a lot, unlike a Sunday league player.

85% of them are that highly tuned that the slightest knock can set them back days, let alone a serious injury, hence the reason Gerrard doesn't want to play this weekend. He knows he won't be 100% and he probably won't do himself justice if he plays.

So its severe tear you are talking about now ? not what torres had which was a slight tear which you said couldnt be true as he would be out for months ? you did say 3 months minimum for a tear where as you can actaully have a slight tear and be out for a couple of weeks and walk ok on it ?

[bigmick]

You don't walk off

I do not know about recovering in two weeks but I tore fibers in my hamstring and walked off the field. I did not play for six months after that but I did walk off. I am sure adrenilin had something to do with it as the next day I was f.ucked.

Just because you agree it does not make it so.

Oh dear oh dear  . Another one for the agree to differ list. Not only the bit about the hamstring injuries, but also the practice of only quoting half the sentence because you think it makes your point more believeable.

Never mind, the list is long and I have plenty of paper  .

[GYBS]

Its simple really - there is all different levels of hamstring injury ( just as with most muscles) starting from small tear which would take a couple weeks to heal up to a severe tear which could take months to heal . for a slight tear you can walk off the field  not limping as it gives you a sore point where the slight tear is and is only painful when the area is touched . as opposed to a sever tear where you cant move the muscle without being in agony . its obvious that nando walked off fine and after what the club docs said it looks like he had a tiny tear which would take around 10 days to heal .

[RedBen]

Come on people, can't we all do what Saint proposed?

Torres hurt his leg.
It needs to heal.

[stmichael]

If they're not 100% then neither Torres or Gerrard should play.

We rushed Torres back far too early against Arsenal last season and he only lasted 45 minutes.

[bigmick]

So its severe tear you are talking about now ? not what torres had which was a slight tear which you said couldnt be true as he would be out for months ? you did say 3 months minimum for a tear where as you can actaully have a slight tear and be out for a couple of weeks and walk ok on it ?

We've fallen out about some strange things on the forum over the years, and none more strange than this. In days gone by, they would have said Torres has "strained" his hamstring when he wandered off. When Michael Owen collapsed in agony clutching the back of his leg and took months to recover, they would have said he had torn his hamstring.

Now whether in all technicality the strain represents a "slight tear" in his muscle (however slight), or in fact he had "tore fibres in his hamstring" I have absolutely no idea. I do though think it reasonable to assume though that the injury (torn hamstring as its commonly known) which many players have suffered from over the years (Michael Owen being the classic example) is different to the one which Torres walked off the pitch with the other day.

Quite why we are choosiung to have an argument about it is beyond me to be honest, but I have absolutely no doubts that some people will be able to pick through this ramble and dress it up as some sort of communist conspiracy at best, or the ramblings of the drinks waiter at worst.

Nothing really to fall out about here I don't think. Unless of course you're determined so to do.

[JamCar05]

If they're not 100% then neither Torres or Gerrard should play.

We rushed Torres back far too early against Arsenal last season and he only lasted 45 minutes.

Agreed. Furthermore they (the 45 minutes) where not exactly his best in the red shirt, so reallly no point in having a half fit Nando (or Stevie) on, if all we do is risk them for the upcoming CL games and the derby in two weeks time.

[Roger Red Hat]

look Torres hurt his leg - rest him - move on.

[Bad Bob]

Half of this is mind games for Ferguson's benefit, IMO.  The Gerrard injury timeline seems to change daily and I think we're purposely keeping everything vague so that Ferguson doesn't know who to prepare for and what tactics to expect.  Perhaps wishful thinking on my part but I would not be surprised if both appeared on the teamsheet Saturday.

[heimdall]

On the bright side at least we'll have a good excuse for Manure kicking our this time. BTW I really really hope we can beat them but I'm just being realistic.

[Owzat]

If they're not 100% then neither Torres or Gerrard should play.

We rushed Torres back far too early against Arsenal last season and he only lasted 45 minutes.

Season lasts a lot longer than 90 mins and we may well lose anyway so I agree. And it's only three points, although I still maintain as I said last season that I can't see us winning the title under Rafa if he can't even beat the mancs (in the league) To me it is an important psychological barrier, and if you took six points off the mancs last season that they took off us and add them to our total then we'd have been ahead of them.....................

[GYBS]

So its severe tear you are talking about now ? not what torres had which was a slight tear which you said couldnt be true as he would be out for months ? you did say 3 months minimum for a tear where as you can actaully have a slight tear and be out for a couple of weeks and walk ok on it ?

We've fallen out about some strange things on the forum over the years, and none more strange than this. In days gone by, they would have said Torres has "strained" his hamstring when he wandered off. When Michael Owen collapsed in agony clutching the back of his leg and took months to recover, they would have said he had torn his hamstring.

Now whether in all technicality the strain represents a "slight tear" in his muscle (however slight), or in fact he had "tore fibres in his hamstring" I have absolutely no idea. I do though think it reasonable to assume though that the injury (torn hamstring as its commonly known) which many players have suffered from over the years (Michael Owen being the classic example) is different to the one which Torres walked off the pitch with the other day.

Quite why we are choosiung to have an argument about it is beyond me to be honest, but I have absolutely no doubts that some people will be able to pick through this ramble and dress it up as some sort of communist conspiracy at best, or the ramblings of the drinks waiter at worst.

Nothing really to fall out about here I don't think. Unless of course you're determined so to do.

its quite simple really - some people have said he could easily of had a slight tear in his hamstring and be out for a couple of weeks and be back for the manc game where as a poster as said that is total and people are talking .

as i said its nice and simple - the guy could easily of had a slight tear which was realised in the statement and could of easily walked off (know this through my physio course)

[bigmick]

as i said its nice and simple - the guy could easily of had a slight tear which was realised in the statement and could of easily walked off (know this through my physio course)

Well if you've done a physio course mate I'm not going to argue the point with you. I suppose you probably wouldn't argue the point either that with a full on hamsrtring tear, a la Michael Owen (or even me cos I can still remember the pain) would result in the player being unable to walk off and then play again in a couple of weeks.

I did notice that whilst I was putting my longish post together (keep the posts long and it keeps the replies sensible as only some can be bothered to read it) you put together a good post yourself mate. Like I say, if you have some technical knowledge of the whole thing you'll not get any argument from me cos I have none, just some bad memories.

[GYBS]

Well if you've done a physio course mate I'm not going to argue the point with you. I suppose you probably wouldn't argue the point either that with a full on hamsrtring tear, a la Michael Owen (or even me cos I can still remember the pain) would result in the player being unable to walk off and then play again in a couple of weeks.

I did notice that whilst I was putting my longish post together (keep the posts long and it keeps the replies sensible as only some can be bothered to read it) you put together a good post yourself mate. Like I say, if you have some technical knowledge of the whole thing you'll not get any argument from me cos I have none, just some bad memories.

Oh agree about owen - he tore his badly - was a deep tear into the muscle that required surgery and then a lot of rehab to get it flexible again . the thing with owen and other severs torn hamstrings is they go straight to the deck after pulling up . i think the point that is missed is how smart torres was by stopping as soon as he felt it a little tight and straight away said to come off to prevent himself further damage . those actions alone prob saved us months of being without him . He prob felt it a little tight just like most footballers or even sportsmen do - but he came off where as other try a little stretch and try to run it off without realising they have do a little tear and more exercise will just worsen it .