Liverpool FC Forum

[The_Rock]

Hmmm..... i voted for Perry........its all feckin perry's fault. If only he had gotten his 1st choice Jose Mourinho in..... everyone here would be a happy clappy hippy... 

Now to run and hide before missles are thrown at me... 

[NANNY RED]

Rock learn to spell , You make me laugh were not doin well an Rock comes out from under the canvas, This Mouriniho you love so fecking much he wouldnt of lasted five minutes with these two, Bags packed an away he would have gone, You need more than missiles thrown at you you need a fecking rocket down your gob.
This is not some pretend WWF sh.ite   here were everyone cheers for the goody an the baddie , Do you know what im wasting my time im gettin meself all airyated an i cant be botherd

[maypaxvobiscum]

Rock learn to **** spell , You make me laugh were not doin well an Rock comes out from under the canvas, This Mouriniho you love so fecking much he wouldnt of lasted five minutes with these two, Bags packed an away he would have gone, You need more than missiles thrown at you you need a fecking rocket down your gob.
This is not some pretend WWF sh.ite   here were everyone cheers for the goody an the baddie , Do you know what im wasting my time im gettin meself all airyated an i cant be botherd

[Number 9]

Rock learn to spell , You make me laugh were not doin well an Rock comes out from under the canvas, This Mouriniho you love so fecking much he wouldnt of lasted five minutes with these two, Bags packed an away he would have gone, You need more than missiles thrown at you you need a fecking rocket down your gob.
This is not some pretend WWF sh.ite   here were everyone cheers for the goody an the baddie , Do you know what im wasting my time im gettin meself all airyated an i cant be botherd

Calm down Nan,that type of reaction is what tw@ts like the Rock are looking for!
The fella is an absolute w@nker,so dont get annoyed about what he says!

He aint been about in a while,probably on a Man City forum Id say!

[heimdall]

Rock learn to spell , You make me laugh were not doin well an Rock comes out from under the canvas, This Mouriniho you love so fecking much he wouldnt of lasted five minutes with these two, Bags packed an away he would have gone, You need more than missiles thrown at you you need a fecking rocket down your gob.
This is not some pretend WWF sh.ite   here were everyone cheers for the goody an the baddie , Do you know what im wasting my time im gettin meself all airyated an i cant be botherd

Calm down Nan,that type of reaction is what tw@ts like the Rock are looking for!
The fella is an absolute w@nker,so dont get annoyed about what he says!

He aint been about in a while,probably on a Man City forum Id say!

yeah but you love it don't you because it gives you an excuse to get all sanctimonious. 

[bunglemark2]

I think talk of "we'll never win the league with these owners" is slightly missing the point. You could also argue that as we would have won it last season "had Torres and Gerrard been fit more often" or we "hadn't spunked it" (whichever way you prefer to look at it), it's not even true really.

Whatever though, the reason it's missing the point is that NOBODY IS DEMANDING THAT WE WIN THE LEAGUE THIS SEASON, PEOPLE ARE JUST LOOKING FOR A DECENT GO AT IT.

Winning the league is very difficult, more so now that man City have been thrown into the mix. I'm not in all seriousness counting Sunderland as being in the mix as I've noticed one or two have started to, or even Spurs. Spurs were bottom of the league with two points and wondering where their next bowl of babyfood was coming from this time last season, while we were top. If they truly have vaulted over us by virtue of the fact they've bought a couple of strikers off Portsmouth (one of them a Liverpool cast off), a bloke who we had no time for whatsoever and couldn't wait to be rid of and a bloke out of Wigans midfield, then either Redknapp is Shankly reincarnated or Rafa truly is a clown and should be sacked immediately. I fully expect, big style, that we get back above Sunderland, Spurs, Villa and the like. Like I say, nobody is demanding we win the league this season. What fans are asking for though, is a challenge. Winning it is hard, winning it without challenging for it is impossible.

Fans are asking for at least a feeling that we might challenge for it fairly consistently. We were within barely a handful of points last term, and Man Utd lost the best player in the World and one of the best strikers in the World (for 80 million quid, one of them they didn't get any money for), and replaced them Antonio Valencia and Michael Owen for 18 million quid combined. Chelsea who we finished above signed one player for 18 million quid who hasn't figured yet. Arsenal who we finished above sold their best striker for 25 million quid, their best defender for 12 million quid and bought an unknown centre half for 10 million quid. We've sold two players for 33 million, and bought two players for 36 million. OK it would have been nice to have spent 68 million, but you can hardly argue that we've been massively outgunned. I even heard mention of Villa "splashing out" lol. They sold their best player by miles for a relative song, and have picked up centre halves who were struggling to figure for Man City and West Ham respectively, as well as a kid from Leeds.

Now of course it's early days yet, and we may still challenge. Come on guys though, lets be serious as the season progresses. If we challenge again and play anywhere near as well as last season, I should think most people would have no problem with saying we are playing the best football we've seen Liverpool play for many a year. I said it myself last season many times. If we don't though, if we truly are nowhere near, then surely there comes a time when looking at it sensibly becomes an OK thing to do? Last season it was because Torres was injured too often (even though the previous season he wasn't and scored 30 goals but we still came nowhere), this season Torres has been fit so it isn't that, ah so it must be the owners and we've been outspent (even though we haven't).

I know they'll be banging out the old "RAFA, RAF-AYE-ELLE" on Tuesday night and imploring those around them to get in behind the manager and the team. I hope the fans do so as well because feck me we need all the help we can get at the moment. In the cold light of day though, on forums and away from the ground, unless things turn around sharply I get the distinct impression it's all going to end in tears.

Mate you're living in La-La land if you think we are in with a sniff of winning the title this season. We are poison at the moment. Yesterday's excuse was our three main players were out. Purely that, an excuse - we haven't got anything like the quality of replacements to make up for it. Spearing ? Gimme a break....Lucas ? I was giving him the benefit of the doubt but no longer. Babel had the opportunity to prove the manager, his teammates and the fans wrong yesterday, and he blew it. Skrtel was poison as well....
This week against Lyon and the weekend against Manure...nahhh, can't see it.....
Dream on if you like, but the writing is on the wall for Rafa

[bigmick]

Mark this is about the third time recently where I've made a post and someone has come in and got the opposite end of the stick to what I'm on about. Heimdall did it yesterday and in a misunderstanding thought I had gone all pro Rafa all of a sudden. I hadn't, I was just trying to put the thing into context and bring a bit of balance to it. I've done that here as well.

I think we are out of the league, gone for all money, dead in the water.

  We are seven points behind the Mancs and obviously anything other than a win at the weekend against them means we are at least seven behind them and we still have to go to their place. Even if we win we are barely back in it. We are six behind Chelsea, three behind Arsenal who have a game in hand and have played both Manchester teams Away, and we are a point behind Man City who have two games in hand over us. We are behind Sunderland. Can we win it from here? Not in my opinion no.

All that said, we can still get into the shake up, into the vacinity, into the same stratosphere as the leaders. Onto their coat tails at least, as opposed to trailing in their slipstream. There is also the cups which given a bit of luck we ought to be able to make a decent run at, so Rafa has much to go for.

[tubby]

Let's just put all this negativity to one side for this week. We have 2 games coming up that we know we can win despite our recent troubles. We beat Utd at home last season with no Torres or Gerrard and we have beaten better teams in Europe with no Gerrard as well. I think Rafa needs to just be a little more defensive and not so ambitious going forward as we are obviously leaving too many gaps at the back. Whether or not Johnson will be able to do that is another matter.

[bigmick]

Let's just put all this negativity to one side for this week. We have 2 games coming up that we know we can win despite our recent troubles. We beat Utd at home last season with no Torres or Gerrard and we have beaten better teams in Europe with no Gerrard as well. I think Rafa needs to just be a little more defensive and not so ambitious going forward as we are obviously leaving too many gaps at the back. Whether or not Johnson will be able to do that is another matter.

"Lets put all this negativity to one side" Bav. Then you say we are conceding too many gaps at the back, and criticise one of our better players this season .


Look, it's not "negative" to assess where we are in the league. It simply involves lloking at the table and who's played who.


I'm certainly not saying we have no chance of beating Man Utd, I actually think they've been very ordinary this season so far. As you say, we beat them without Gerrard and Torres last season so it's certainly possible. That doesn't mean of course that I think we definately will beat them either. No amount of sitting there like an Egyptian mummy with my forefingers and thumbs pressed together going "Ommmmmm" can change what I think unfortunately.

Unfortunately, as I ventured in the much derided "golden opportunity theory" I think we will find it much harder to take all the points off our immediate rivals than we did last season. Ferguson will want to win and win well, to effectively dance on our grave. Either with or without Torres and Gerrard it will be a very tough match and I fancy a 1-1 draw.

I think we'll beat Lyon though, which will no doubt prompt a bit of "so where are all the moaning c...s now".

[Reg]

Would we be in this position if we'd signed Gareth Barry?

I think not.

[bigmick]

Would we be in this position if we'd signed Gareth Barry?

I think not.

I don't think we would either. Some people have talked about the fact that we have desperately missed Alonso, and we quite obviously have. If the first nine matches have proven anything beyond a shadow of doubt, it's that Lucas is no deputy for Xabi Alonso in any way shape or form. When Gerrard has played in central midfield we've won every match, when he hasn't we've prety much lost every match. Conclusive You decide.

Barry was 12 million quid and he's played every week for Citeh so far. I know people will say he went there for the money and that we couldn't have matched his wages (and we couldn't) but I don't believe that. He said himself that he found some of the comments coming out of the club offensive, and pointed out that as players were on ridiculous money anyway a few thousand pounds before tax here and there was never going to be the deciding factor.

Somewhere along the line, either he went off us or we went off him. aquilani will have to be extremely good to make him seem like a better option given what we know now, put it that way.

[Madmax]

We would have been in a better position had we snapped a fully fit proficient replacement for alonso. That replacement could have been anyone either barry or whatever aslong as his better than lucas.

[red_guy]

3 straight losses, 5 conceded , not a single goal scored.  People talking about how we manage to beat Manure last season w/out Torres and Gerrard... at least last season we have better CM in Alonso and Mascha..this season we have the 'excellent' Spearing and Lucas...put mascha with one of those two, still we can get nothing out of it....just praying that Aquillani is the perfect Alonso replacement or we might have to put Gerrard  in his old position..

[Rush Job]

People often talk about "wasted" money, and for sure there have been some poor buys but the manager has been at the club for six years so you are bound to get one or two of those. Also significant though I think are some of the sells. I know people bang on about such and such a player wanting away, but I can probably name more than a couple of strikers who we could really do with now who we have had and let go.

Also it's a question of planning for me. It appears that we had little choice but to sell Alonso in all honesty, but to plan to go into the new season with Lucas stepping up reeked of a fairly reckless gamble to me. For sure Aquilani may turn out to be a great player, we all obviously hope he is, but Rafa's statements at the time that he had bought the player "for five years not five minutes" now look a bit questionable. I know it was well appreciated on here, as is the annual "you don't win the title in September" but as we know only too well, you can certainly lose any chance of winning it very early on. For me once we knew Alonso was away (which I firmly believe we knew last season) we should have gone ahead with our original plan and got Gareth Barry. I can't understand why we didn't have him all wrapped up, neither can I understand why or when we changed our mind about him. Stick Barry in for Lucas and would we have lose four league matches? I suppose it's possible but the now Man City man is a much better player, not Xabi Alonso perhaps but certainly a good replacement. And then once we didn't get him, for me we should have been setting our stall out to play Gerrard central midfield. Each time he's played there we've won, each time he hasn't we've lost (bar one game i think). I know that's not categoric proof, but it's certainly an indication that he makes a huge difference in there when he plays.

Now had we picked up Barry for the 12 million, we would have had the change for perhaps a bid for the Sunderland centre half. We could maybe have put a wee bit more towards it and pipped them for their striker as well.

That's where I tend to have problems with Rafa and his management style. Good man, good coach, loves the club and all that stuff but how can we possibly go into a league season with Kuyt, Voronin and N'Gog as cover for Torres who picks up the oidd injury? How can that be? Is it the owners fault we haven't got striker cover? No, not for me it isn't no.

I cant help but feel Rafa was under the impression he had more in the kitty than he did.
There was word of a Upson bid being turned down by the bank and not being able to free up space on the wage bill by getting rid of the likes of Dossena and Voronin didnt help either. People always say we should get rid of the likes of them but had anyone been interested we would of.
As far as Barry goes we did try to sign him but he turned his back on us for the ££££ on offer at city, hence Rafa`s he went there for the money comments.
The owners and Rafa.
Who voting for Parry?

[Octsky]

Some people on here need some lessons on modern football formations. In modern football, there is no such thing as a formation being a defensive or offensive. It really depends on how you execute it and what type of players are playing. If you're playing Johnson and Aurelio as wing backs can it be called a 5-3-1? or is it 3-5-1. Well the answer is that it is BOTH! this is the flexibility of this system and you need to have wingbacks who have lots of stamina. If you're pressing your opponents the wingbacks attack and become 3-5-1. If you're defending the wing backs track back and becomes 5-3-1. Similarly if you're playing 3 in the middle than it can be the offensive 4-3-3 or defensive 4-5-1 or it can also still be a 4-4-2 (see Gerrard and Torres attacking). People on here seem to just see what they wanna see and say "arghh how can rafa play 4-5-1  (worse 5-4-1) against this team or that team". Yesterday we had kuyt, babel and benayoun as attacking players and johnson and aurelio also joins in the attacks from the wings. Can't it be said then that this is 3-2-2-3? To me it looked like a pretty balanced team and shouldn't have any problems beating Sunderland on paper. And yet we have people generalizing it "ughhh rafa is playing 5-4-1 against Sunderland".    The old-fasion-ness on here sometimes beggars believe.

Playing 5-4-1 or as u said 3-5-2 has long long been countered by 4-4-2 and model formation of 4-3-3 has been used recently to counter the conventional 4-4-2.

Why played 3 centre backs when they cant even properly marked 2 CF??

Why isolate a single CF on top when we need to win this game?

the problem of playing 3 CB is that you dont need 3 CB to mark 2 average CF (ok, Bent is just a bit above avg), u dont need 3 CB when you are chasing a goal. He11, i used to remember the Mourner or old fergie playing CB as target man in the dying min to grab a precious goal.

If there's an argument of Ngog and Voronin not being good enough to start and lead the line with Kuyt when Torres is down, then why are they still in the club?? Why is there no backup for Torres? or why are there backups but u dont trust them to lead the line when needed, then why are they still here?
you dont need to be a rocket scientist to tell that Torres wont be playing every single game.

if we played 5-4-1 against the great Sunderland team, then how are we going to play against Manyoo? 6-3-1?? or 7-2-1??