Liverpool FC Forum

[RUSHIE#9]

I would be absolutely shocked if Eto'o left Barca in the summer. We have no one in the squad that can replace him, so would need to bring in a replacement. Why buy someone else when you already have the best?

Apparently* Txiki Beguerestein(sp?) (Barca bigwig) has been rumoured to have said something in the last few days that Barca haven't given up hope of signing Henry.

I think that there are alot more factors than normal involved in signing Eto'o. Going on the news reports over here (which may not be as accurate as in espana) the transfer of Eto'o would probably be reliant on:-

1. Frank Rijkaard no longer wanting him (Obviously)

2. Has he REALLY fallen out with team mates? (Strongly Rumoured)

3. Ronaldinho being sold to Milan. (Deal already agreed - Strong rumour)

4. Barca being able to get a replacement in for Eto'o i.e. Henry/Shevchenko (Rumours again)

*According to Sky's Revista de La Liga - Not a cast iron source, I know.

ALOT of speculation I know but thats exactly what I see being between us and signing Eto'o, for starters. We still have the possibility of other teams coming in for him if Barcelona are open to offers.

The Alsonso speculation is just being brought into the discussion because of the supposed interest in him coming from the Nou Camp. Add to that the 'dropping' of him and people are putting the two together and coming up with an incorrect answer. Rafa has been known to make some surprising tactical descisions you know.

[LFC2007]

Another thing that worries me is the mentality of ANY player we sign it is well publicised about Rafas rotation, is a big name player going to come here and have games sat on the bench or will they want to play every game, will Rafa risk upsetting the applecart by not rotating a big name signing, he has shown in the past that he is his own man and has not been afraid to show it, Alonso dropped being one example and the famous 100 game rotation farce. So i for one cant see him making any guarantee to any player that he will play all the time

This is where Rafa earns his money, getting big name players to sign with no guarantees regarding starting each game

IMO the time has now come for rotation to stop and for him to find a settled 11 and baring injuries or serious lack of form stick to it, we will have a much better chance of attracting theses players if he does that not to mention winning more trophies

Rergarding Owen i would have him over Eto or Tevez simply because you just know what you will get, he is ( if he stays fit ) a guaranteed 20+ a season goalscorer and with the clause in his contract regarding Newcastle not being in europe we would get him for a less than half the 17million they payed for him, therefore leaving more money for the other targets that Rafa has in mind

You can't guarantee any player first team football, Rafa has said this before, he will look to sign a player with a view to using him. The extent to which he uses that player depends on how they perform, injuries, match strategy, competing players' performances, training ground performances, tiredness, our fixture list, atittude and many others.
He will make his judgement on meeting the player, player references, scout reports, coach/manager references etc etc...... He will not read a sunday newspaper that reports Eto'o is unhappy about being on the bench, or how he disagrees with Rijkaard and then go on to make a malinformed judgement.
It's not a case of Rafa 'upsetting the apple cart,' he is the boss, he decides - not Eto'o. Like I said, he will form his judgement with well founded information not Sunday newspaper reports.
I agree that Rafa should keep a more settled side in the Premiership, but a player that says 'Benitez's rotation policy is putting me off joining them' is not a player I want at Liverpool FC - much like Lucas Neill, he chose money over us and gave the excuse that he wasn't sure if he would play many matches. Well, if your not up for fighting for your place like every other player, then you don't deserve to wear the red of Liverpool.

I agree with you that Owen is a proven goalscorer in this division and his injuries are a worrying factor. The geordies also see him as the replacement to Shearer, they hold him in high regard and I think Owen wants to repay that faith. The expectation that Owen will stay at Newcastle and go on to become the new shearer (or as close as one gets) is something I think he would find difficult to blag his way out of. I can't see Owen moving on this summer, he at least (in my opinion and by all accounts) wants a full season at Newcastle to prove why they paid so much for him and why they have so much faith in him.
Finally, have you seen Michael Owen's contract? I seem to remember Newcastle publicly saying that there is NO clause in his contract whatsoever allowing him to leave for a disclosed amount if a top four team came in for him. This is different to the Bellamy situation where Blackburn acknowledged the clause in his contract and said there is nothing they could do. Unless you're Owen's agent?
Or Freddy Shepherd in disguise?

[destro]

Regarding the rotation, in a round a bout sort of messed up way ( typing with a wriggling one year old on my knee lol ) thats what i was trying to say about Rafa, that he wouldnt guarantee any player a place in the team.

As for the type of player who says they want to play for us and isnt put off by the rotation policy i think we will find  more quantity than quality, its finding the balance between wanting to play for us and being good enough or wanting to sit on our bench and collect their wages. A player who is good enough AND happy to be rotated are few and far between, hence the line about Rafa earning his money


Its been all over the radio today regarding his contract and not just the same story on each station, it was last mentioned on talksport by a newcastle journalist, who in fairness also said the same as you that he expects Owen to show at least a full seasons faith to Newcastle for sticking by him. The contract clause doesnt state that it regards a top four club coming in for him , it states that if they fail to get into europe, Newcastle denied A specific rumour they didnt deny that there was a different clause

[LFC2007]

Rumours are rumours, nothing concrete.

[Sabre]

Rumours are rumours, nothing concrete.

So true. But then, there are some facts that worries me.

Alonso is a man very linked to his father. He wears the 14 because he wants the 4 that Hyypia has, as soon as Hyypia goes, he'll get it, just as his father used. And Alonso is for the same reason very linked to his former club and Barcelona

It's a fact aswell Barcelona had unconvincing players in Xabi's position, Motta for instance.

It's a fact aswell Begiristain, their signing up man (in Spain, one thing is the coach and another who makes signings up) is interested.

It's a fact aswell, that Rafa said recently that some negotiation talks were taking longer than expected, and that some of them might be have to be postponed to after the final.

All this mixed keeps me worried from a while ago to be honest.

When Alonso left my local club, it wasn't hard to me, we needed the money and he went to the other club of my heart. Plus, I admit, I was a bit proud of you appreciating the game of one city-mate, after the good service that men like aldridge, westerveld, kvarme gonzo and toshack provided to my local club.

But if he goes to Barcelona... that will change a lot of things in my view, Xabi will not be a player I love anymore, but an stranger.

Hope he stays. Last season he scored a goal away at 2PM and at 2am I found him in a bar of San Sebastian. I talked with him, he talked marvelous things about Liverpool and LFC. His eyes opened with admiration when talking about Carragher, and Gerrard. Literally the expression was "SON LA HOSTIA" if there's any spanish speaking guy there, and which the closest translation would be "they're fúcking great".

Xabi, stay, FFS. 

[metalhead]

Rumours are rumours, nothing concrete.

So true. But then, there are some facts that worries me.

Alonso is a man very linked to his father. He wears the 14 because he wants the 4 that Hyypia has, as soon as Hyypia goes, he'll get it, just as his father used. And Alonso is for the same reason very linked to his former club and Barcelona

It's a fact aswell Barcelona had unconvincing players in Xabi's position, Motta for instance.

It's a fact aswell Begiristain, their signing up man (in Spain, one thing is the coach and another who makes signings up) is interested.

It's a fact aswell, that Rafa said recently that some negotiation talks were taking longer than expected, and that some of them might be have to be postponed to after the final.

All this mixed keeps me worried from a while ago to be honest.

When Alonso left my local club, it wasn't hard to me, we needed the money and he went to the other club of my heart. Plus, I admit, I was a bit proud of you appreciating the game of one city-mate, after the good service that men like aldridge, westerveld, kvarme gonzo and toshack provided to my local club.

But if he goes to Barcelona... that will change a lot of things in my view, Xabi will not be a player I love anymore, but an stranger.

Hope he stays. Last season he scored a goal away at 2PM and at 2am I found him in a bar of San Sebastian. I talked with him, he talked marvelous things about Liverpool and LFC. His eyes opened with admiration when talking about Carragher, and Gerrard. Literally the expression was "SON LA HOSTIA" if there's any spanish speaking guy there, and which the closest translation would be "they're fúcking great".

Xabi, stay, FFS. 

It would be a really depressing day if he leaves sabre! i hope he doesnt!

[Effes]

Re. talk of swapping (with money) Xabi for Eto'o - that new UEFA ruling means he can
buy out his contract this Summer and leave for peanuts.

So, if we dont get him to sign a new contract - that "buy-out" clause could become a major factor. He could be leaving for far less money than we imagine.

[LFC2007]

Rumours are rumours, nothing concrete.

So true. But then, there are some facts that worries me.

Alonso is a man very linked to his father. He wears the 14 because he wants the 4 that Hyypia has, as soon as Hyypia goes, he'll get it, just as his father used. And Alonso is for the same reason very linked to his former club and Barcelona

It's a fact aswell Barcelona had unconvincing players in Xabi's position, Motta for instance.

It's a fact aswell Begiristain, their signing up man (in Spain, one thing is the coach and another who makes signings up) is interested.

It's a fact aswell, that Rafa said recently that some negotiation talks were taking longer than expected, and that some of them might be have to be postponed to after the final.

All this mixed keeps me worried from a while ago to be honest.

When Alonso left my local club, it wasn't hard to me, we needed the money and he went to the other club of my heart. Plus, I admit, I was a bit proud of you appreciating the game of one city-mate, after the good service that men like aldridge, westerveld, kvarme gonzo and toshack provided to my local club.

But if he goes to Barcelona... that will change a lot of things in my view, Xabi will not be a player I love anymore, but an stranger.

Hope he stays. Last season he scored a goal away at 2PM and at 2am I found him in a bar of San Sebastian. I talked with him, he talked marvelous things about Liverpool and LFC. His eyes opened with admiration when talking about Carragher, and Gerrard. Literally the expression was "SON LA HOSTIA" if there's any spanish speaking guy there, and which the closest translation would be "they're fúcking great".

Xabi, stay, FFS. 

I understand that Sabre, but when Rafa comes out and publicly says we are trying to get our key players signed on to long term deals (one of these being Xabi) and Xabi coming out and saying 'I want to stay', 'it is my dream to win the premiership' then in all likelihood I expect just that to happen.

He may be linked with Barcelona because of his father, and ok maybe in the future he would like to fulfil an ambition by playing for them but for now I don't see that happening. He is living in Liverpool, he is settled and he is part of a team that are building towards Premiership success.

Barca may have unconvincing players in Xabi's position but so do many other clubs. I'm sure there are plenty of clubs interested in signing Ronaldinho, but interest alone means nothing.

The fact that a sporting director, in this case Begiristain, declares an interest in a player is irrelevant. There are plenty more sporting directors/managers who signal their interest in players, but it means nothing unless the player himself says he wants to leave to go elsewhere. As yet Xabi has not said this, quite the contrary, he has said he wants to stay.

The fact that negotiations over renewing his contract may be taking longer than had been expected is arguably reminiscent with the Gerrard/Chelsea scenario. This situation however is very different, Gerrard is not Xabi, nor are Chelsea Barcelona. Negotiations do take time, and this time it is with 5 or 6 key players within the side that are taking place concurrently. There are bound to be delays etc. that's what happens with many contract renewals.... e.g. Ferdinand, Ronaldo, Viduka etc..... it's part of business. To read any more into this would be paraniod and pessimistic.

I can't see it happening unless something unforseen happened, e.g. Bellamy going on another golf club/Karaoke rampage in Spain and hitting Xabi. If this happened maybe I could see him leaving this summer.

[Sabre]

I understand that Sabre, but when Rafa comes out and publicly says we are trying to get our key players signed on to long term deals (one of these being Xabi) and Xabi coming out and saying 'I want to stay', 'it is my dream to win the premiership' then in all likelihood I expect just that to happen.

What? he said that?? and I missed it??? 

My fúcking fault. Sorry. Thank you for making me happy tonight.

[LFC2007]

Re. talk of swapping (with money) Xabi for Eto'o - that new UEFA ruling means he can
buy out his contract this Summer and leave for peanuts.

So, if we dont get him to sign a new contract - that "buy-out" clause could become a major factor. He could be leaving for far less money than we imagine.

The same could be said for Gerrard and Lampard if they wanted to move abroad, they are in the same position contractually. It's not a 'buy out' clause in the true sense of the phrase, it is the right to terminate the contract under certain circumstances, e.g. giving appropriate notice and moving to another country. If the player is under 28 and three years into a contract, the player can cancel his contract, if over 28 they can be just two years into that contract and resign.
Albeit the player himself would have to 'buy ouy' the final year of the contract, and may have to pay compensation to the club, it depends on the circumstances.

[EddieC]

Re. talk of swapping (with money) Xabi for Eto'o - that new UEFA ruling means he can
buy out his contract this Summer and leave for peanuts.

So, if we dont get him to sign a new contract - that "buy-out" clause could become a major factor. He could be leaving for far less money than we imagine.

The same could be said for Gerrard and Lampard if they wanted to move abroad, they are in the same position contractually. It's not a 'buy out' clause in the true sense of the phrase, it is the right to terminate the contract under certain circumstances, e.g. giving appropriate notice and moving to another country. If the player is under 28 and three years into a contract, the player can cancel his contract, if over 28 they can be just two years into that contract and resign.
Albeit the player himself would have to 'buy ouy' the final year of the contract, and may have to pay compensation to the club, it depends on the circumstances.

I haven't understood this rule ever since it came into place. I thought the whole point of the Bosman ruling was that a contract's a contract but after that you're free to do as you like. Are we now saying that a contract isn't a legally binding document anymore?

[LFC2007]

Re. talk of swapping (with money) Xabi for Eto'o - that new UEFA ruling means he can
buy out his contract this Summer and leave for peanuts.

So, if we dont get him to sign a new contract - that "buy-out" clause could become a major factor. He could be leaving for far less money than we imagine.

The same could be said for Gerrard and Lampard if they wanted to move abroad, they are in the same position contractually. It's not a 'buy out' clause in the true sense of the phrase, it is the right to terminate the contract under certain circumstances, e.g. giving appropriate notice and moving to another country. If the player is under 28 and three years into a contract, the player can cancel his contract, if over 28 they can be just two years into that contract and resign.
Albeit the player himself would have to 'buy ouy' the final year of the contract, and may have to pay compensation to the club, it depends on the circumstances.

I haven't understood this rule ever since it came into place. I thought the whole point of the Bosman ruling was that a contract's a contract but after that you're free to do as you like. Are we now saying that a contract isn't a legally binding document anymore?

There's a new ruling that has just been passed by FIFA in the case of Andy Webster, who left Hearts while 3 years into a 4 year contract. He has to pay £625,000 compensation, which as yet the calculation of the fine is unknown, but the final years wages of Webster were factored into the fine, that was the only thing disclosed. The basis of the ruling is that players can terminate their contracts but only under certain circumstances, of which I have given some in my other post, e.g. must move abroad, or under jurisdiction of a new football association, hence why Webster to Wigan was allowed.

[EddieC]

Re. talk of swapping (with money) Xabi for Eto'o - that new UEFA ruling means he can
buy out his contract this Summer and leave for peanuts.

So, if we dont get him to sign a new contract - that "buy-out" clause could become a major factor. He could be leaving for far less money than we imagine.

The same could be said for Gerrard and Lampard if they wanted to move abroad, they are in the same position contractually. It's not a 'buy out' clause in the true sense of the phrase, it is the right to terminate the contract under certain circumstances, e.g. giving appropriate notice and moving to another country. If the player is under 28 and three years into a contract, the player can cancel his contract, if over 28 they can be just two years into that contract and resign.
Albeit the player himself would have to 'buy ouy' the final year of the contract, and may have to pay compensation to the club, it depends on the circumstances.

I haven't understood this rule ever since it came into place. I thought the whole point of the Bosman ruling was that a contract's a contract but after that you're free to do as you like. Are we now saying that a contract isn't a legally binding document anymore?

There's a new ruling that has just been passed by FIFA in the case of Andy Webster, who left Hearts while 3 years into a 4 year contract. He has to pay £625,000 compensation, which as yet the calculation of the fine is unknown, but the final years wages of Webster were factored into the fine, that was the only thing disclosed. The basis of the ruling is that players can terminate their contracts but only under certain circumstances, of which I have given some in my other post, e.g. must move abroad, or under jurisdiction of a new football association, hence why Webster to Wigan was allowed.

Cheers for clearing that up, still think it's b0llocks though. Players got enough freedom after the Bosman ruling, what more do they want? At the end of the day it's simple, don't sign a contract you're not willing to honour. We all have to put up with that fact in everyday life, why should footballers be any different?

[LFC2007]

Re. talk of swapping (with money) Xabi for Eto'o - that new UEFA ruling means he can
buy out his contract this Summer and leave for peanuts.

So, if we dont get him to sign a new contract - that "buy-out" clause could become a major factor. He could be leaving for far less money than we imagine.

The same could be said for Gerrard and Lampard if they wanted to move abroad, they are in the same position contractually. It's not a 'buy out' clause in the true sense of the phrase, it is the right to terminate the contract under certain circumstances, e.g. giving appropriate notice and moving to another country. If the player is under 28 and three years into a contract, the player can cancel his contract, if over 28 they can be just two years into that contract and resign.
Albeit the player himself would have to 'buy ouy' the final year of the contract, and may have to pay compensation to the club, it depends on the circumstances.

I haven't understood this rule ever since it came into place. I thought the whole point of the Bosman ruling was that a contract's a contract but after that you're free to do as you like. Are we now saying that a contract isn't a legally binding document anymore?

There's a new ruling that has just been passed by FIFA in the case of Andy Webster, who left Hearts while 3 years into a 4 year contract. He has to pay £625,000 compensation, which as yet the calculation of the fine is unknown, but the final years wages of Webster were factored into the fine, that was the only thing disclosed. The basis of the ruling is that players can terminate their contracts but only under certain circumstances, of which I have given some in my other post, e.g. must move abroad, or under jurisdiction of a new football association, hence why Webster to Wigan was allowed.

Cheers for clearing that up, still think it's b0llocks though. Players got enough freedom after the Bosman ruling, what more do they want? At the end of the day it's simple, don't sign a contract you're not willing to honour. We all have to put up with that fact in everyday life, why should footballers be any different?

I know, you sign a contract on the basis that you will honour that contract. It seems player power has increased more than ever, it also means that the final year of the contract is worth little. The only thing to appease clubs is the gurantee that the least they will receive if this does happen is the amount equal to the player's annual wage. Compare this to the transfer fee for most top players and you see what it means, usually a lot less than a years wages.

[Effes]

It seems mad to think that Barca would ever let go of Eto'o.

Re. swapping Xabi/cash for Eto'o - do they need Xabi? They already have Xavi
and he's only 27. Would like to see what Sabre or Barca Murph have to say about this.

The more I think about it the less I think it will happen.