Liverpool FC Forum

[maguskwt]

Ngog and Torres pairing will never going to work mark my words. It's like Mascherano and Lucas pairing. Both are out and out strikers who doesn't compliment each other. Too alike (and I'm not talking quality here).

[In and Out]

Ngog and Torres pairing will never going to work mark my words. It's like Mascherano and Lucas pairing. Both are out and out strikers who doesn't compliment each other. Too alike (and I'm not talking quality here).

Do you think Roy would persist with it like the Lucas Masha combo was persisted with last season ?

I honestly don't think N'gog is good enough to polish Torres' football boots, let or lone playing upfront for Liverpool. Something surely has got to happen before the end of the transfer window closes regarding this situation.

[7_Kewell]

Ngog and Torres pairing will never going to work mark my words. It's like Mascherano and Lucas pairing. Both are out and out strikers who doesn't compliment each other. Too alike (and I'm not talking quality here).

Torres would work with this guy tho  click

[Bad Bob]

Okay I'll try and add a bit of decent discussion to this thread.

FWIW the formation Roy chooses will need time to be bedded in especially if it's a 4-4-2. Last night was the first time N'gog and Torres played upfront together. He surely needs the privelidge of finding the best dynamics with the players at his disposal, unfortunately some of those players shouldn't be near the first team squad on such a regular basis, whatever...


I wasn't that impressed with Citeh to be honest we weren't on the back ropes so to speak we were just chasing shadows most of the night. Those shadows were being chased in midfield and it's not as if they were attacking us at will. Tevez IMO was the difference between our strikers and theirs, he made the ball stick, he controlled the ball brillantly shrugged a player off and waited for support. Something either N'gog or Torres couldn't do, Kuyt to was guily of trapping the ball further than John Madden can kick.

It was the same under the previous manager our ball retention as a team overall is so fecking poor in comparison to at least half a dozen sides in the Prem. Instead of retaining the ball our lads are to quick and from to deep always looking to play the killer pass, it's to predictable. Jovonovic was a dissapoint last night, infact the midfield four as a unit were, both Jovanovic and Kuyt were largely inefficient out wide. Nothing really clicked, we did have a few nice patterns of play during the first half and a little pressure in the second half but isn't nearly enough. I remember when we played this formation under Rafa and couldn't get a win for toffee, then all of a sudden he went 4.2.3.1 and we went on a role, the team dynamics were better. Perhaps after looking at that last night we don't really have the personel to play a 4-4-2 and even if we do it will take a hell of a lot of work to get it working.

We played 4-4-2 under Houllier and that worked (different players of course) and the one thing I did notice compared to last nights game was that Houllier always had the two banks of four tight together. It was a unit, first the oppo would have to break down a wall of four and do the same against the defence to get a sight on goal. We were hard to break down, but last night there was no discipline players were caught out here and out of poition there, we didn't look like a unit it looked erratic.

Citeh on the other hand played lovely little composed triangles and their ability and control on the ball made certain players on our side look like amateurs. Firstly their retention was class and their movement off the ball was good ours was non-exsistant and that has nothing to do with ROy at this early stage of his season, we've always been like this even under Rafa. Yet Roy went for an expansive approach maybe due to force changes or whatever it didn't pay off, he'll learn from it. It will take more transfers unfortunatley to get the right players in who look comfortable with the ball at their feet, Cole being one of them, Aquallani perhaps would have been another.

I'm not going to loose sleep over this as no way can I see this season being anyworse than last seasons shambolic displays, just give the guy a chance ffs.

Good post.  I would add two things that have been said before but were illustrated again last night:

1) Kuyt is not especially suited to the RM role in a 4-4-2.  He spent half the night dropping into CM to get the ball off Lucas or Gerrard, which meant that our shape was all wrong.  When he did get the ball, he did little with it because he's not a play-maker from the middle of the park.  When he got it out wide, his distribution was poor and his ability to retain possession was weak.  Johnson had a bad night at the office behind him, which didn't help either.

2) Ngog doesn't hold the ball up particularly well at all.  That's a liability whenever he plays, whether as a lone striker or as a foil for Torres.  He needs to get much stronger at holding off defenders as, far too often, he gets brushed aside when the ball comes into feet and we're under the cosh once more.  The lad's shown that he can be useful as an out and out striker (fox in the box type) but we need much more than that from our forwards regardless of the system we play.  They must be able to retain possession and bring teammates into play.

[maguskwt]

Ngog and Torres pairing will never going to work mark my words. It's like Mascherano and Lucas pairing. Both are out and out strikers who doesn't compliment each other. Too alike (and I'm not talking quality here).

Torres would work with this guy tho  click

I think PSV kinda refused us already mate... they said he's not for sale or something along that line... he'd be a good addition though. An attacking midfielder/ striker... who can run with the ball, head the ball and strike the ball equally well. I'd say give them 10million + Ryan Babel FFS... he can take his rapping back to holland for all I care...

[maguskwt]

Rafa reacting to Liverpool's result against City:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nVcJk0omTT0

disclaimer: tongue in cheek guys 

[tubby]

Roy's Liverpool- How's it regressing...

Should rename the topic title to that.

[shabelle50]

I was castigated about three days ago on here for suggesting that if Liverpool lost last night it would be the end of Hodgson's honeymoon. When I made that comment I didn't imagine for a moment that it would be 3-0 last night.

I'd say it's fair to say that a few people on here and elsewhere got a bit carried away with the signing of Joe Cole, a couple of above average games against some part timers from Eastern Europe and a 1-1 home draw against Arsenal. Even without Torres Liverpool had Cole and Gerrard at home to Rabonitcki therefore four or five would have been an acceptable scoreline. The excuse about players coming back late from the world cup doesn't wash. The performance against Trabzonspor wasn't great either in all honesty.

Hodgson through his honesty and straight talking approach has won the plaudits of many who doubted whether he would be the right man to take on the Liverpool job. On the evidence of last night however it's clear that the problems of last season are still apparent with the squad. While it is still early in the season if things don't pick up quickly on Thursday in Turkey and against West Brom at the weekend I strongly doubt that Roy Hodgson will be the Liverpool manager at the end of this season, whoever owns the club.

[Kopite-Jud]

Rafa reacting to Liverpool's result against City:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nVcJk0omTT0

disclaimer: tongue in cheek guys 

HAAHAHAHAHAHA 

[Kopite-Jud]

is it me or do we still not have another striker?

[Igor Zidane]

4-4-2 will not work imo .. Look at last night and it shows you everything you need to know. Gerrard considered one of the best midfielders in the world  was ineffective , why? He had only Lucas beside him and they were struggeling to get the ball off , or when they  had the ball through 3 very effective midfielders in dejong ,barry and the man mountain yaya toure. Not only that, johnson on the right was providing width and milner on the left was roaming all over the show including coming infield and creating more problems for gerrard and Lucas . Kuyt was awful and could not keep possesion or find a team mate , jovanovic was no better . So the pressure was building and building on Gerrard and Lucas to contain the city midfield rather than impose there own game on city . If roy was placed into a predicament by mascherano's no show then that's why he played N'gog up with torres . N'gog was trying but his ball retention was poor so the ball kept going back to city and off they went again through there midfield or out wide to johnson . Roy should have taken the gamble and played poulson with Lucas . It would have left Gerrard to play behind Torres and there midfield would atleast been checked and would have had a harder night . I'm not saying we would have won , but i'm certain we would have been more competative and would of had a better chance at getting a result .

Ok so now we've got 2 hard fixtures out of the way with 1 point . It's not the end of the world and i'm not @rsed to be honest about trabsonspour .Roy needs to get back to 4 3 3 for west brom at home and kick there @rses all over the shop.

[Kopite-Jud]

4-4-2 will not work imo .. Look at last night and it shows you everything you need to know. Gerrard considered one of the best midfielders in the world  was ineffective , why? He had only Lucas beside him and they were struggeling to get the ball off , or when they  had the ball 3 very effective midfielders in dejong ,barry and the man mountain yaya toure. Not only that, johnson on the right was providing width and milner on the left was roaming all over the show including coming infield and creating more problems for gerrard and Lucas . Kuyt was awful and could not keep possesion or find a team mate , jovanovic was no better . So the pressure was building and building on Gerrard and Lucas to contain the city midfield rather than impose there own game on city . If roy was placed into a predicament by mascherano's no show then that's why he played N'gog up with torres . N'gog was trying but his ball retention was poor so the ball kept going back to city and off they went again through there midfield or out wide to johnson . Roy should have taken the gamble and played poulson with Lucas . It would have left Gerrard to play behind Torres and there midfield would atleast been checked and would have had a harder night . I'm not saying we would have won , but i'm certain we would have been more competative and would of had a better chance at getting a result .

Ok so now we've got 2 hard fixtures out of the way with 1 point . It's not the end of the world and i'm not @rsed to be honest about trabsonspour .Roy needs to get back to 4 3 3 for west brom at home and kick there @rses all over the shop.

spot on 

[shabelle50]

There's a lot of delusion on these blogs. The players were terrible last season and they've not been much better this season, particularly last night. Rabonitcki were hardly much opposition and only 2-0 was a poor scoreline in all honesty. Only the away game could be considered progress given that there were a few kids playing. The turks showed Liverpool up last week when they put men behind the ball.

The truth is that the likes of Kuyt, Lucas, and one or two others are not good enough to play for Liverpool. I'm not even convinced by Skyrtel anymore or Carragher when he comes up against pace. Either that or the players are just not bothered the way they were in 08/09.

I'm all for supporting the team and Roy but enough is enough now even just two games in. I'm not confident about thursday or sunday and to say that is incredible.

[mart]

FWIW the formation Roy chooses will need time to be bedded in especially if it's a 4-4-2. Last night was the first time N'gog and Torres played upfront together. He surely needs the privelidge of finding the best dynamics with the players at his disposal, unfortunately some of those players shouldn't be near the first team squad on such a regular basis, whatever...

Obviously, but why did he then decide to test a new formation against a presumably top team? This is one of the teams we need to stop if we are trying to get back into the top 4. Obviously he needs to test things, but why not make a change when something obviously isnt working?

We dont have the players for 442 so why is it so important to use that formation? Just because he is used to it? I'd rather he tried to get players that can fill the roles we need for a 442 before he decides to use that formation.

[mart]

Gerrard considered one of the best midfielders in the world  was ineffective , why? He had only Lucas beside him and they were struggeling to get the ball off , or when they  had the ball through 3 very effective midfielders in dejong ,barry and the man mountain yaya toure.

Thats part of the reason. I've never been that impressed with Gerrard as a CM. He just isnt the playmaker that alonso was and doesnt get as involved as when he plays further up on the pitch in a more free role. Sure he might do a crowdpleasing tackle now and again but we have other players that can tackle.