GYBS wrote:aCe' wrote:Fo Dne wrote:Emerald Red wrote:Fo Dne wrote:Emerald Red wrote:Fo Dne wrote:s@int wrote:Leonmc0708 wrote:s@int wrote:We seem at the moment to have a few disagreements going in various threads about just how good some of our players are, and whether player "a" contributes more than player "b" etc etc and even whether player "c" should even be at our club at all.
I thought we could try and explain our reasons why we think the way we do about the different players, and which category we see them as fitting best into.
World class (Would get on most teams in the world)
Reina, Mascherano, Gerrard, Torres.
Top class (Would get in most teams squads )
Carragher, Alonso, Hyypia (was but maybe not now)
Good player (good enough for a title winning team)
Skrtel, Agger, Riera, Arbeloa(?) Keane(?) Aurelio(?)
Decent squad player
Kuyt, Lucas, Insua, Cavelieri
Would prefer to see sold
Voronin, Pennant, Benayoun, Degan, Dossena, Ngog
No doubt I have missed someone out and offended people by not putting their favourite players in the "right" category. This is my view of the players and even then I have questions about quite a few.
To explain a couple of my more controversial decisions.
I put Masch as world class and Alonso as "only" top class because I think there are quite a few better players than Alonso in his role, and I don't believe there is a better player than Masch at what he does. Like it or lump it thats my view.
Arbeloa , Keane and Aurelio, I was torn between them being squad players and good players but decided to be happy clappy for once and put them in possibly a higher category than maybe they deserve.
Benayoun, is no doubt good enough to be a decent squad player alongside Kuyt etc etc, I think he tends to narrow the pitch too much when he plays and I think we could get better for similar money to what we would get for him.
You are Stu the Red and I claim my five pounds.
Get a clue
Stu would NEVER say Masch is World class, possibly not even Reina(?)
Just because I feel like I'm going to break them up even further into more groups.
The Elite: (Top five players in the world)
Steven Gerrard: Absoloutely unbelievable player. Wouldn't swap him for anyone and don't believe any other player is capable of his performances being played completely out of position. Absoloute monster of a player and we'll be lucky to see another one who is nearly as good in all our years as Liverpool fans.
Fernando Torres: Quite simply unplayable at his best. Fast, strong, skillfull, lethal finisher, great in the air, unbelievable movement, wonderfull touch, can shoot from distance. Not as important as Gerrard, but easily in the top five players in the world for me.
World class players: (in and around the top 6-20 players in the world)
None
Top class players: (Players who'd get into pretty much every side).
None (Would have had Sami Hyypia in here a few years ago)
Excellent players: (good enough to win a league with, have some excellent attributes but theres alot around that are as good)
Alonso: Again, excellent use of the ball, reads the game well, keeps possession well and links up well with other good players.
Reira: Excellent use of the ball, intelligent and links up well with others, provides superb balance.
Keane: Has yet to produce in a red shirt but through no real fault of his own. Has superb vision, his movement is world class and his link up play is exceptional. Technically he's good aswell. Just needs to settle and get to the level of confidence needed to play consistently well for this club, in terms of ability there are no worries.
Good players: (Usually consistent or decent and played in the right system, next to the right players, can have a positive effect)
Hyypia: Still think he's our best centre half for me. Not as good as he used to be but still shows signs of class. Good on the ball, uses it well and still dominant in the air. Reads the game superbly. Obviously lacks alot of mobility these days.
Carragher: Could probably push him up a level due to what he gives Liverpool and the fact he's a leader but I don't believe in overating your own. Solid defensively, has his faults but doesn't everyone.
Skyrtel: Solid without being spectacular.
Agger: Again solid without being spectacular. Excellent and carrying the ball out from the back. Would be nice is his passing ability was upto the same standard.
Mascherano: Good in the tackle but a poor passer. Excellent at reading the game aswell and where to press the ball.
Decent squad player: (not really first teamers but you can get away with the odd one)
Insua, Aurelio, Bennayoun, Pennant, Arbeloa
Absoloute rubbish that needs to go:
Kuyt, Voronin, Ngog, Babel, Lucas, Degen, Dossena, Cavalieri
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We've got a decent squad, we just need a couple of additions but they have to all be improvements on what we have. For me this team has potentially a great mix of the right players if we can find the type of players and obviously they have to be of the required standard to suppliment the ones we already have.
The Elite? So there's a class above world class? Jesus, now you're just making sh*t up. If you're talking about trademark, legendary players that can be put in the same bracket as the likes of Pele, Maradonna, Zidane, etc etc, well, that's just a question of time, and time is something Torres is still to attest to. God forbid, he could get a bad injury and fade into relative obscurity like Owen has. As for us having no world class players either, well, you're seriously having a laugh there.
Name our world class players then.
Why, so you can patronize and tell me I haven't a clue? I'll name two who I think are world class apart from our obvious two superstar players. Xavi Alonso and Pepe Reina.
So a player who lacks mobility, scores approximately 5 goals a season (being generous) and plays a hell of a lot of square passes and often comes far to deep to collect the ball is in your opinion should be in the same catorgary as Steven Gerrard?
Alonso, as good as he is isn't a world class player. He's a very good one, but there are a large number of players in the league of the same ability if not more so. Players with more mobility, aggression, power and even better technical players. Alonso also, away from home especially can cause us problems by coming so deep to receive the ball, this though is probably beyond your limited understanding of the game and I won't waste my time going into to it to share with an arrogant, stupid little fukwit who only comes on here to argue with anyone dares to question Rafa the great and doesn't know what it is to support his local team.
Pepe Reina is a class keeper. I like him alot. But he's not world class in my opinion.
so he's been banned over this post ?!
sorry if im missing something but if its because of this post then its absolutely ridiculous if you ask me !
one of the better posters in this forum and hey.. he talks about football for a change.. same cant be said about some of the mods... i mean... who was it who started the insults and bullsht nonsense in this thread again ? yea thought so
i guess calling someone awit is ok then ? yes the guy does post stuff about football but cant do it without insulting someone or trying to demean them and their opinion - have to show some sort of tolerance towards poster something which he fails to do - imo .
O right and you don't call people names and get away with it do me a favor.
