Liverpool FC Forum

[Sir Roger]

Having watched the man u match five times now (shes going mad but Im not ars.ed) I have to be honest and say that the manner in which we won was far from spectacular in a footballing sense.

Bóllocks. You don't watch unspectacular games 5 times in 48 h.

Ha
Pay attention there sport

I didnt say the game was unspectacular I said the manner wasnt from a football sense.
It was cut and thrust, smash and grab, which is spectacular. But it wasnt a footballing classic was it?

A brilliant win nevertheless and fully deserved against an over-rated team with a dodgy defence.
And I watched the first half again last night
And watched MUTV to see the reaction

Thats all well and good fella, but what baffles me is why anyone on this forum would pay money to subscribe to Mutv ? ,am I missing something   

Who said anything about paying money?

[Sir Roger]

An 8 for me , plenty more good times from Rafa and the team to come . I still have my head buried in the sand - oops sorry i meant i still believe and have faith in him . 

The post was better before you edited it mate. Once more we are seeing the "ooh aren't I clever" phenomenon on here. Why oh why will people not learn, both sides do it and it doesn't matter how many times you point it out.

Pro's being pro's are back slapping away, getting little digs in where they think they are deserved. There's people talking with irony about how Man Utd are a "poor side", people imploring posters to HAVE SOME FAITH IN THE MANAGER!!!!!!!! and now the irony of the "head in the sand jibe".

We watch football for all these years and still we don't pick up on the little nuances. You take three goalkeepers to World Cups not because you'll ever need them, but because you know that if you don't the two goalkeepers you do take will get injured on the bumber cars. It's the laws of football. You have striker back up at all times because you know the minute you don't, both of your strikers will get injured and you'll lose your chance of winning the league. The laws of football again. And you don't get too full of yourself when things go right, because you absolutely know what will happen next. Don't tempt fate lads, FFS.

To that end, I didn't agree with Rafa talking about how Man Utd were "weak" if you attacked them in this way and that way. Apparently hoofing it out of defence so Vidic could fall over it and then Torres could score was part of the grand plan. It looked a bit gloaty to me, and will once again tempt fate a bit. Iwonder if that same ploy will work if we draw them in the Champions League, or whether it's more or less likely to now we've told everyone about it.

The gods of football, don't anger them 

Couple of good posts there
Having watched the man u match five times now (shes going mad but Im not ars.ed) I have to be honest and say that the manner in which we won was far from spectacular in a footballing sense.
Yes Torres mugged Vidic, but it was from a clearance out of our box. Route one, hoofball, etc.
As was the fourth. Each goal being due to the massive mistakes of both Vidic, then Ferdinand not clearing the ball by heading it away. Then we add a penalty and a free kick.
I am by no means undervaluing the massive achievement of battering them tw@ts in their own back yard. Nor am I criticising the way we created and scored the goals. I am just being a bit cautious about maybe thinking that weve turned a tap on here and goals will come gushing out. Theres a renewed energy, belief, attitude thats been missing for a while and long may it continue.
But I agree with you that we shouldnt get too carried away, even though the last week has been the best for a long time.

Wouldn't you agree, though, that every goal scored in football occurs as a result of someone making a mistake/failing in their duty?

Dont get me wrong
Ill take a win every time even if a goal comes off someones ars.e.
I was just pointing out that that was exactly how we scored, through their calamitous and some would say atypical errors and not from free-flowing, crisp passing football.
We capitalised on their fear

I prefer the version which suggests Torres rushed Vidic and forced the error.

Subtle difference, but much more accurate.

Thats my version too
They were terrified
That goes without saying

[heimdall]

I think it was a very great win, yes they made some errors but they were forced into them by great pressure play from Torres and Gerrard.

I don't agree that all goals are scored because of mistakes, some goals are just beautiful and are created out of nothing more than footballing genius.

[redbeergoggles]

As always some interesting posts. I don't honestly think anyone is "clamouring for Rafa to be ousted" anymore than I think Mourinho's Inter "ajectly surrendered" to the Mancs. There's a thread for that discussion elsewhere though so we won't get into it here.

"Fickle" rears it's head again, although so far "not a real fan" and "hoping Liverpool lose" has not put in an appearance, though it will.

For my part, I've been saying for a good while now (three seasons) that we have a team which is/was plenty good enough to challenge for the title. This season, we probably have a team ,much on this forum ,I have never been one for habitual self congratulation.
As for your point about Torres, I would have to say Liverpool played largely to his strengths last season ,as opposed to this season when the wingers have been utilised to a better effect to account for fernando's absence ,but still this has robbed us of our most potent attacking force .
I think the draws we have had this season could easily have been wins but for crossbars and posts and the visiting teams reluctance to leave their own half, albeit the Middlesborough game which I agree was a debacle.
Football is a unpredictable game fella ,thats why we love it ,and I believe that Rafa is the best man for the job .
As for the Skyrtel episode at left back, isnt it Rafa's ability to be clever and complicated that allows him the fortitude to succeed in a tactical chess match against the bigger sides, its been proven time and time again Rafa has few peers when the big games come along ,so to remove this particular trait from his game would make him ordinary and we dont need ordinary at Liverpool .
I too think some of his decisions ie Skyrtel at left back are indeed questionable ,but who in all honesty would them two imbeciles that run our club acquire to replace Benitez .
Fact is until we rid the club of the inner turmoil thats haunted us all season (Hicks n co ) then it really will take a phenomenal manager to take us forward .
Ok I digress I for one never envisaged winning the title this season ,too huge a leap from Fourth to First ,and I never believed Keane would be our missing piece of the jigsaw ,but I knew we would improve under Rafa and that faith has been justified ,We can play verbal tennis all day Michael, but lets say we both have the best interests of the club at heart albeit slightly different perspectives .

Just to add to my observations ,I would have to concur with you Mick, that we have a side capable of mounting a serious challenge. but the quality of the squad is not the issue ,if it was about the quality of individual players then I reckon Spurs would be in the top five instead of languishing just below mid table . 
We all know its about teamwork and consistency the byword for any successful team ,but the manager I hasten to add can instill these attributes into his team ,no manager and I include any in the premier league, is above making individual errors and tactical mistakes .
Rafa if we can forgive his tactical nuance's is making less than last year, that is patently obvious ,maybe as I stated earlier if not for the intervention of posts ie Stoke away and Fulhams goal living a charmed life at Anfield ,games I attended as well as Stoke at home we annihilated these teams ,but it was'nt to be our day ,sometimes the ball wont go in thats football .
I too agree with the latter part of your post Rafa needs to buy quality ,but if he had the players he requested Liverpool would be brimming withn quality and that includes the bench.

[bigmick]

Nice post RBG. First though I must come back to the "lucky goials", not enjoying the win and all that nonsense. I'll do it for no real reason, as I'm sure the people who are getting carried away won't actually read the post, just like they obviously didn't read the last couple.

Firstly, I did "enjoy the win". It seems ridiculous to me having to state that, incredible really, but I'll say it again, I enjoyed the win. If anybody can find a single post of mine before, during or since the win where I appear not to have "enjoyed" the win, then good luck to em. Why oh why do we have to have this same charade time after time after time. It is possible to look into the game at a level which is deeper than "Whoohoo we won" while still "enjoying" the win. I'm getting angry typing this. Angry with myself really that I waste time and have done for the last four seasons, justifying my support of a team who I have supported since I was a little kid to people I've never met and never will. I didn't actually "expect the team to lose" either funnily enough but what does it matter. I actually predicted us getting home in a thriller 3-2. I also predicted we would beat Ral Madrid Home and Away. I really must stop being so doom and gloomy. It doesn't matter though, people don't bother reading any of that. They just assume they know you, assume you don't "enjoy the win" and off they go.

I will come back at some point and comment on what I said in my Gods of football post as opposed to what people seem to think I said, but I'll have to leave it for now. "Enjoy the win". feck me.

[zarababe]

Oooooh welcome back Lando

[Sabre]

I think it was a very great win, yes they made some errors but they were forced into them by great pressure play from Torres and Gerrard.

I don't agree that all goals are scored because of mistakes, some goals are just beautiful and are created out of nothing more than footballing genius.

I think there were mistakes in the opposition, but some mistakes only can be punnished by top quality, if you see what I mean.

The first goal mate was very beautiful. It was like one of those nature documentaries, in which you see a leopard hunting down a prey.

Vidic had an aerial ball incoming. Grey in the repetition said, just head it, but it was not a simple question. The ball came with a difficult angle, it wasn't that easy to give strength to it with a header as it came. And Vidic doubted. Why did he doubt??



Because Mascherano was incoming his inmediate man upfront, and Kuyt was running like a demon in the bottom part of the image.

So Vidic decided to turn back, try to protect the ball, and then the nature documentary started.

Torres started the run like a feline, instead of choosing the weaker gazelle, Torres was waiting the error or Vidic, like a predator. When the moment of control reached, the feline attacked, and he applied his strenght, pretty much like in the Euro final, to win an unlikely ball helped by a burst of pace he's one of the few he has.

It was a mistake yes, but why Vidic made a "calamitous mistake" against us and not against Tottenham? Not because the Rafa rant, no, but because there was a well done work of pressing (that things are prepared), and there was a world class player to hunt down a chance at the slightest mistake.

Very beautiful goal. That aspect of his strength in that clashing with players, is something that Torres has now in Liverpool but had not in Atletico Madrid. The Torres of Atletico, wouldn't have scored in the Euro nor against in the Vidic play. That's something he has to be grateful of to the English style of game. In fact, I think every Spanish player in the current squad have bettered their game for getting experience in the premiership.

[Bam]

Nice post RBG. First though I must come back to the "lucky goials", not enjoying the win and all that nonsense. I'll do it for no real reason, as I'm sure the people who are getting carried away won't actually read the post, just like they obviously didn't read the last couple.

Firstly, I did "enjoy the win". It seems ridiculous to me having to state that, incredible really, but I'll say it again, I enjoyed the win. If anybody can find a single post of mine before, during or since the win where I appear not to have "enjoyed" the win, then good luck to em. Why oh why do we have to have this same charade time after time after time. It is possible to look into the game at a level which is deeper than "Whoohoo we won" while still "enjoying" the win. I'm getting angry typing this. Angry with myself really that I waste time and have done for the last four seasons, justifying my support of a team who I have supported since I was a little kid to people I've never met and never will. I didn't actually "expect the team to lose" either funnily enough but what does it matter. I actually predicted us getting home in a thriller 3-2. I also predicted we would beat Ral Madrid Home and Away. I really must stop being so doom and gloomy. It doesn't matter though, people don't bother reading any of that. They just assume they know you, assume you don't "enjoy the win" and off they go.

I will come back at some point and comment on what I said in my Gods of football post as opposed to what people seem to think I said, but I'll have to leave it for now. "Enjoy the win". feck me.

Mick ignore it mate, those posts are written to wind you up.

Feck em, they talk more bollox than I've had hot dinners.

[Dalglish]

Faith defines every fan IMO and if your not believing in the team, tactics, manager or fans ability to influence the outcome then I for one wonder why your involved in this crazy game!

As for Faith IN Benitez in the sense is asking the question Do you trust him ? Do you believe he can achieve your dreams and aspirations ? Is he the "Messiah" that will finally deliver the Holy grail ?

Football is akin to religion for many and although i don't subscribe to that concept I certainly have trust in Rafa Benitez in that he aspires to succeed as manager of this team. However I also believe he sometimes allows his own personal failings as a human being to cloud his judgement and affect his decisions or how else can you view "Keane-gate" On this and other matters there have obviously been forces at work behind the scenes that have perhaps caused him to deviate from what he believes is best for LFC and what he needed to do to substantiate his own position.

I think most of us barely imagine the level of pressure and politics that have enveloped the club in the last couple of years and it would be unthinkable that the club would have "aired its dirty" etc in the past when Liverpool FC was akin to the Masons in it's secrecy.

However, all things considered I still believe Rafa Benitez represents our best chance of winning the Premiership and to dispense with his services now or at the end of the season would not be something I'd personally support.

Walk on ..............

[Sabre]

I like the "Keane-gate" naming. It really was a debacle for me the whole thing. And we've paid for it in terms of points.

[redbeergoggles]

Faith defines every fan IMO and if your not believing in the team, tactics, manager or fans ability to influence the outcome then I for one wonder why your involved in this crazy game!

As for Faith IN Benitez in the sense is asking the question Do you trust him ? Do you believe he can achieve your dreams and aspirations ? Is he the "Messiah" that will finally deliver the Holy grail ?

Football is akin to religion for many and although i don't subscribe to that concept I certainly have trust in Rafa Benitez in that he aspires to succeed as manager of this team. However I also believe he sometimes allows his own personal failings as a human being to cloud his judgement and affect his decisions or how else can you view "Keane-gate" On this and other matters there have obviously been forces at work behind the scenes that have perhaps caused him to deviate from what he believes is best for LFC and what he needed to do to substantiate his own position.

I think most of us barely imagine the level of pressure and politics that have enveloped the club in the last couple of years and it would be unthinkable that the club would have "aired its dirty" etc in the past when Liverpool FC was akin to the Masons in it's secrecy.

However, all things considered I still believe Rafa Benitez represents our best chance of winning the Premiership and to dispense with his services now or at the end of the season would not be something I'd personally support.

Walk on ..............

Class post fella

[Dalglish]

Hi Sabre,

If we do not win the League this season then "kenae-gate" will be up there in my TOP 3 reasons why not. Whichever way you look at it you don't pay £20 Million for a player then not play him. Morientes, Kewell, Crouch, Cisse etc.... all got a long run of games to establish themselves. Keane did not.

[LegBarnes]

I like how many voted on my funny quote he is frank spencer lmao and he done ya wife but you would forgive him. 

I used to be a 2-3 I went up to a 8 but now i am back at around 6

[bigmickspersonaldildo]

He's a good manager with good players at his disposal, it's just a shame he doesn't use his own and the players skills to the best of their ability often enough.

[Kharhaz]

He's a good manager with good players at his disposal, it's just a shame he doesn't use his own and the players skills to the best of their ability often enough.

What a shame. When personal vendettas have presidence over your own opinion. Its sad, in a very disturbed way.