Liverpool FC Forum

[Sir Roger]

The difference between Man U and Liverpool is equal to the difference between Liverpool and Middelsborough.

Great, let's hope we win 2-0 on Saturday

Good shout

[kazza]

I would have been happy with 2-0. I wish this poll can be retaken as after todays match Raffa deserves to go up one.

[fivecups]

I think I've moved from the six I voted for around the time of the Middlesborough match to about an 8 or 9 after the past week - funny how a few  matches can shift opinion.

Incidentally, in terms of progress the win today means we have 61 points - that's more than we finished the league with in 03/04 and 04/05.

[LegBarnes]

Just every one wanted to know how the votes would go after the game lets ave a look shall we. 

I voted 8

[Big Niall]

great result today but he is no better or worse than he was yesterday.

lets all just enjoy the result.

[Redman in wales]

I'm not having a dig at 5cups here, but i'm not quite as fickle as lose 2 matchs and vote 8 or 9, win 2 matchs vote 6 or whatever.

We've just had 2 magnificent wins against 2 good teams. that doesn't change the fact that we've failed to break down the lesser sides like hull, fulham, stoke etc. We drawn too many games. same problem as last season, and despite the fact that we can finish 2nd this season, i still have my doubts whether rafa can bring us the league.

[Flight]

I'm not having a dig at 5cups here, but i'm not quite as fickle as lose 2 matchs and vote 8 or 9, win 2 matchs vote 6 or whatever.

We've just had 2 magnificent wins against 2 good teams. that doesn't change the fact that we've failed to break down the lesser sides like hull, fulham, stoke etc. We drawn too many games. same problem as last season, and despite the fact that we can finish 2nd this season, i still have my doubts whether rafa can bring us the league.

How much difference do you think it would have made if Stevie and Nando had been fit to play every Prem game together instead of the just over half a dozen they have ?

[account deleted by request]

I'm not having a dig at 5cups here, but i'm not quite as fickle as lose 2 matchs and vote 8 or 9, win 2 matchs vote 6 or whatever.

We've just had 2 magnificent wins against 2 good teams. that doesn't change the fact that we've failed to break down the lesser sides like hull, fulham, stoke etc. We drawn too many games. same problem as last season, and despite the fact that we can finish 2nd this season, i still have my doubts whether rafa can bring us the league.

How much difference do you think it would have made if Stevie and Nando had been fit to play every Prem game together instead of the just over half a dozen they have ?

How much difference do you think it would have made if we had had a credible replacement for them being injured....... such as Keane ?

All teams get injuries, its up to the manager to ensure when injuries occur that there is an adequate replacement. Rafa sold ours without replacing him. Maybe not the cleverest bit of business Rafa has ever done?

[kazza]

I'm not having a dig at 5cups here, but i'm not quite as fickle as lose 2 matchs and vote 8 or 9, win 2 matchs vote 6 or whatever.

We've just had 2 magnificent wins against 2 good teams. that doesn't change the fact that we've failed to break down the lesser sides like hull, fulham, stoke etc. We drawn too many games. same problem as last season, and despite the fact that we can finish 2nd this season, i still have my doubts whether rafa can bring us the league.

How much difference do you think it would have made if Stevie and Nando had been fit to play every Prem game together instead of the just over half a dozen they have ?

How much difference do you think it would have made if we had had a credible replacement for them being injured....... such as Keane ?

All teams get injuries, its up to the manager to ensure when injuries occur that there is an adequate replacement. Rafa sold ours without replacing him. Maybe not the cleverest bit of business Rafa has ever done?

We have scored more since Keane left than when he was here. When he was here we could not buy a goal.

[Bad Bob]

Let's not cloud the issue with a specific focus on Keane.  Saint's point is sound: yes, Torres and Gerrard are the heartbeat of our team in an attacking sense and we go well when they're playing together 9 times out of 10.  But, the reality of football is that one or both will get injured for spells most seasons and we can simply not afford to be reliant on them staying fit all season if we want to properly challenge for the title.  If not Keane, we need some other credible attacking threat to compensate for their inevitable absences and, ideally, more than one.  Rafa's got some important work to do on that front this summer, presuming he stays.

[Sir Roger]

I'm not having a dig at 5cups here, but i'm not quite as fickle as lose 2 matchs and vote 8 or 9, win 2 matchs vote 6 or whatever.

We've just had 2 magnificent wins against 2 good teams. that doesn't change the fact that we've failed to break down the lesser sides like hull, fulham, stoke etc. We drawn too many games. same problem as last season, and despite the fact that we can finish 2nd this season, i still have my doubts whether rafa can bring us the league.

How much difference do you think it would have made if Stevie and Nando had been fit to play every Prem game together instead of the just over half a dozen they have ?

How much difference do you think it would have made if we had had a credible replacement for them being injured....... such as Keane ?

All teams get injuries, its up to the manager to ensure when injuries occur that there is an adequate replacement. Rafa sold ours without replacing him. Maybe not the cleverest bit of business Rafa has ever done?

We have scored more since Keane left than when he was here. When he was here we could not buy a goal.

To be honest I think we should let the Keane thing go
Rafa didnt want him and thats why he treated him the way he did.
Hes gone and we have done the business in the last two games (finally).
Hats off to Rafa for those results
I believe he should get the praise as well as the criticism.
Lets hope he can inspire, motivate and rally the team to go on and achieve something this season.
We shall see...

[account deleted by request]

I'm not having a dig at 5cups here, but i'm not quite as fickle as lose 2 matchs and vote 8 or 9, win 2 matchs vote 6 or whatever.

We've just had 2 magnificent wins against 2 good teams. that doesn't change the fact that we've failed to break down the lesser sides like hull, fulham, stoke etc. We drawn too many games. same problem as last season, and despite the fact that we can finish 2nd this season, i still have my doubts whether rafa can bring us the league.

How much difference do you think it would have made if Stevie and Nando had been fit to play every Prem game together instead of the just over half a dozen they have ?

How much difference do you think it would have made if we had had a credible replacement for them being injured....... such as Keane ?

All teams get injuries, its up to the manager to ensure when injuries occur that there is an adequate replacement. Rafa sold ours without replacing him. Maybe not the cleverest bit of business Rafa has ever done?

We have scored more since Keane left than when he was here. When he was here we could not buy a goal.

Badbob summed it up better than I ever could. I will leave it at that.

[Sabre]

Let's not cloud the issue with a specific focus on Keane.  Saint's point is sound: yes, Torres and Gerrard are the heartbeat of our team in an attacking sense and we go well when they're playing together 9 times out of 10.  But, the reality of football is that one or both will get injured for spells most seasons and we can simply not afford to be reliant on them staying fit all season if we want to properly challenge for the title.  If not Keane, we need some other credible attacking threat to compensate for their inevitable absences and, ideally, more than one.  Rafa's got some important work to do on that front this summer, presuming he stays.

I presume he will stay and I agree that point.

Hopefully, we'll realise aswell it's not realistic to pretend to be a top team without depth in the middle. That is, we need BOTH Mascherano and Alonso, for the very same reason you wield in what I'm quoting.

Quality squad depth is crucial.

P.S. Fivecups: That was the point of the thread, to measure the different levels of trust, and to notice how, after some victories, you can go from 6 to 7, or from 3 to 4. All of us. So those close to the border are not fickle, it's just they're close to the border

[dawson99]

Let's not forget as well, we are the last team in English football to be unbeaten at home... thats a good thing yes?

[JoeTerp]

Let's not cloud the issue with a specific focus on Keane.  Saint's point is sound: yes, Torres and Gerrard are the heartbeat of our team in an attacking sense and we go well when they're playing together 9 times out of 10.  But, the reality of football is that one or both will get injured for spells most seasons and we can simply not afford to be reliant on them staying fit all season if we want to properly challenge for the title.  If not Keane, we need some other credible attacking threat to compensate for their inevitable absences and, ideally, more than one.  Rafa's got some important work to do on that front this summer, presuming he stays.

and that is the 50 million dollar question. Both in the theoretical and in the pragmatic, of who we should bring in. I think in theory, we have a great set of back up right now. Players like Kuyt and Babel should be able to play up top as that is what Babel says he is all the time and Kuyt was a pretty decent goalscorer in Holland. And we have a wild card player in Yossi who can fill in anywhere across the attacking midfield 3. Then we have a "promising" "on the rise" 19 year old with height and pace that just needs some good ol' fashion Liverpool molding and coaching before he is the next Trezeguet, and meanwhile wont be in any kind of position to complain about not playing every week.

Theoretically, a lot of people seem to be in the by Torres a partner. Someone who is nearly just as world class and that will fit well with Torres in a 4-4-2, as well as being able to play with Gerrard in the 4-2-3-1 in the same way that Torres can.

When you buy a player of 20 plus million at Liverpool, as I read from Bigmick this summer, you have to play him every week. Keane started off the season playing in just about every game. And whenever he was dropped, it made news splashes (something that doesn't happen at United). So this means that if we do buy a big time player, which is what almost everyone is calling for, they are going to need to be able to fit in in the starting XI as well as working as replacing one of the two or possibly both roles in the Gerrard-Torres relationship that is currently working so well.

How do we answer that riddle? Either we change the system a bit (Gerrard on right in 4-4-2, Gerrard in middle drop one of Alonso or Mascherano in 4-4-2, or try a 3-5-2 system with Gerrard in an attacking mid role supporting both Torres and his new partner)      OR    we buy someone who will start over Kuyt, Babel, or Riera and mostly play out wide, but who is also better than Kuyt and Babel at playing up top on his own, and as a bonus, able to partner Torres in a (gerrardless) 4-4-2




And once we answer these theoretical questions its a matter of seeing who in the real world fits the bill, how much do they cost, and how much do we have spend, and is it worth selling others in order to have enough to buy?