Liverpool FC Forum

[Bad Bob]

Of the ones mentioned I reckon that either Joaquin or Rodriguez would be affordable, would be willing to consider a move and would improve our right side no end.  As Riera's started to show, you don't necessarily have to be in the top bracket of world wingers to help make us a better side, such has been the level of our wing play in recent seasons.

[LFC2007]

I think even someone like Malbranque would be a big improvement on what we've got. He went to Sunderland for £5m or something, so he was definitely affordable prior to being sold.

[Fo Dne]

I think even someone like Malbranque would be a big improvement on what we've got. He went to Sunderland for £5m or something, so he was definitely affordable prior to being sold.

Always liked him but thought after his injuries at Spurs he'd gone off the boil alot. Seems to have regained his confidence though as the first game against us he was excellent and I agree... he would be a massive improvement on anything we have in this side. For me, at the minute, the priority has to be a top right back as Arbeloa just doesn't cut it.

[maguskwt]

.                        Reina

Arbeloa    Carragher    Agger    Aurelio (Dossena)

                Alonso      Masherano

Kuyt(Babel)         Gerrard (Keane)         Reira(Babel)

                       Torres (Keane)


On current form, it has to be like this...

Reasons?
Gerrard is arguably our best player (Reina, Mascherano, Carragher, and Torres challeges him but gerrard just has a bit more of a winning factor) so give him a role he's happiest with... and this role is a free role in the hole behind Torres... we've all seen how he plays there compared to other positions... he just looks alot more happy and active during the marseille game when he was playing in a similar role...

Torres is our best striker... give him a role where he is the most destructive... and last season proved that this is the one. Also Gerrard -> Torres link up seemed to work pretty well...

2 DM's or CM's give the chance for both Alonso and Masch to be on the pitch... and they're both classy players with different qualitites to them... win/win situation

Kuyt or Babel on the right... not much to choose between them really... one works hard, harry opponents, tracks back, make things happen with his harrying, the other, fast, direct, attack minded, put opponents on the back feet. Both contribute with an occasional goal. Would stilll choose Kuyt over Babel because Kuyt works tirelessly for the full game and Babel's still yet a super-sub.

Riera on the left, the most natural winger we have and left footed. He's looking good in the games he played so far.

Agger and Carragher as our CB's... renew the successful pairing before Agger got injured... Agger IMO is still a better CB than Skrtl... Hyppia and Skrtl as back ups... I don't mind the occasional inclusion of Sami when we have to deal with tall strikers and aerial threats...

Full Backs... Not much to say really... our weakest area and that's all we have...


Implications
yes, our 20 million pound striker is on the bench, sadly and with the form he's showing he quite rightly should be.

yes, our new henry (babel) is on the bench, sadly. (all the fanboys cry outrage). But wait, he comes on as a sub and scores! (all the fanboys cry yay!)

yes, Riera seems to be our only useful buy in the summer. ( I know I know It's still early... Dossena could still come good
.... just kidding Keane too)

[bigmick]

.                        Reina

Arbeloa    Carragher    Agger    Aurelio (Dossena)

                Alonso      Masherano

Kuyt(Babel)         Gerrard (Keane)         Reira(Babel)

                       Torres (Keane)


On current form, it has to be like this...

Reasons?
Gerrard is arguably our best player (Reina, Mascherano, Carragher, and Torres challeges him but gerrard just has a bit more of a winning factor) so give him a role he's happiest with... and this role is a free role in the hole behind Torres... we've all seen how he plays there compared to other positions... he just looks alot more happy and active during the marseille game when he was playing in a similar role...

Torres is our best striker... give him a role where he is the most destructive... and last season proved that this is the one. Also Gerrard -> Torres link up seemed to work pretty well...

2 DM's or CM's give the chance for both Alonso and Masch to be on the pitch... and they're both classy players with different qualitites to them... win/win situation

Kuyt or Babel on the right... not much to choose between them really... one works hard, harry opponents, tracks back, make things happen with his harrying, the other, fast, direct, attack minded, put opponents on the back feet. Both contribute with an occasional goal. Would stilll choose Kuyt over Babel because Kuyt works tirelessly for the full game and Babel's still yet a super-sub.

Riera on the left, the most natural winger we have and left footed. He's looking good in the games he played so far.

Agger and Carragher as our CB's... renew the successful pairing before Agger got injured... Agger IMO is still a better CB than Skrtl... Hyppia and Skrtl as back ups... I don't mind the occasional inclusion of Sami when we have to deal with tall strikers and aerial threats...

Full Backs... Not much to say really... our weakest area and that's all we have...


Implications
yes, our 20 million pound striker is on the bench, sadly and with the form he's showing he quite rightly should be.

yes, our new henry (babel) is on the bench, sadly. (all the fanboys cry outrage). But wait, he comes on as a sub and scores! (all the fanboys cry yay!)

yes, Riera seems to be our only useful buy in the summer. ( I know I know It's still early... Dossena could still come good
.... just kidding Keane too)

It's a good post that Magus. I don't agree with all of it necessarily but It's well thought out and raises some interesting points.

While there is a distinct possibility that this is our actual best team on current form, we would be saying that after all the transfer shenanigans of this Summer, that we could have just bought Riera for 8 million quid or whatever he was and had done with it.

Be that as it may, I still harbour a very strong belief that Keane will prove to be an excellent signing. He strikes me as the sort of lad who needs an arm round his hsoulder, to feel wanted and needed and to feel as if he fully deserves his place in the team. Given his fairly ordinary start, he won't be feeling that yet but it'll come. When it does, I am absolutely convinced that the best XI we could put out with our current personel would include the captain on the right. This would have the dual effect of allowing us to to replace Kuyt, and also allowing us to get Masherano and Alonso onto the pitch.

At the back I like Aurelio, Agger and Carragher with Arbeloa, with keane and Torres up top.

[Number 9]

Im sick hearing where Gerrard "prefers" to play.Yeah he's a fantastic player and our captain but he plays where he's told by the manager like everyone else.It's not his choice where he plays,it's his job to play where he is told and he's paid £100k a week to do so.
It strikes me as selfish IF he is dictating that he wants to play in the middle....Whats he gonna do if he gets put out right again,huff to the papers?Move to Chelsea?
To have all our best players on the pitch and field the most balanced M/F we can the right is the only place for him.With Alonso looking like he may be getting back to his best and Mascherano being crucial to our recent success and Riera being the only natural left M/F we have there is no other sensible place on the pitch for him IMO!
Its time Rafa grew a set of balls and told him thats where he will be playing and to get used to it!

[Rockthekop]

Gerrard has to be played in the middle, he's the engine room of the team when he's playing and that's where he's most effective. 

Do we really need two holding players in every game? I don't think so, especially against the poorer teams in the league. Kuyt is a good defensive player, he does enough work for two men as we all know.  We don't need Mash, Alonso and Kuyt. 

I would like to see this setup at home regularly:

Reina

Arbeloa    Carragher    Agger    Aurelio

               Masherano (Alonso)

Babel           Gerrard         Reira

             Torres     Keane

[Number 9]

Gerrard has to be played in the middle, he's the engine room of the team when he's playing and that's where he's most effective. 

Do we really need two holding players in every game? I don't think so, especially against the poorer teams in the league. Kuyt is a good defensive player, he does enough work for two men as we all know.  We don't need Mash, Alonso and Kuyt. 

I would like to see this setup at home regularly:

Reina

Arbeloa    Carragher    Agger    Aurelio

               Masherano (Alonso)

Babel           Gerrard         Reira

             Torres     Keane

Our very best eleven and you'd drop either Alonso or Mascherano to accomodate Ryan Babel?
Both if at their best are 5 times the player he ever will be.Alonso is not just holding midfielder either,when he's on song he rips teams to shreds with excellent defence splitting balls!

Its simple if you want to field the best 11 Gerrard,Masch and Alonso all need to be on the pitch,because they are 3 of our best players!Babel is'nt up there.

[Rockthekop]

We don't need two DM in every game, that's all I'm saying.  Depending on the game we can play Babel and leave Alonso or Mash on the bench. 

Games against teams like Stoke at home should start with Babel and Riera on the wings with Gerrard and Alonso/Mash in the middle and Torres and Keane up top.  Basically an attacking line up.  We are a tad too defensive sometimes against weaker teams.

[maypaxvobiscum]

babel should be used as a supersub unless he improves his game intelligance.

[Number 9]

We don't need two DM in every game, that's all I'm saying.  Depending on the game we can play Babel and leave Alonso or Mash on the bench. 

Games against teams like Stoke at home should start with Babel and Riera on the wings with Gerrard and Alonso/Mash in the middle and Torres and Keane up top.  Basically an attacking line up.  We are a tad too defensive sometimes against weaker teams.

But thats the thing Alonso is not just a "defensive" midfielder mate.I don't know where people get that illusion from.
He's showing signs of getting back to his best,he does so much more than just shield the back 4 when he plays well.
Im not saying you are wrong,Babel is good enough to play a part at times.But its about our very best 11 and Ryan Babel does'nt feature amongst that group.

And there is no way that Alonso or Masch should be left on the bench regularly to accomodate him

[Fo Dne]

Gerrard is arguably our best player (Reina, Mascherano, Carragher, and Torres challeges him but gerrard just has a bit more of a winning factor) so give him a role he's happiest with... and this role is a free role in the hole behind Torres... we've all seen how he plays there compared to other positions... he just looks alot more happy and active during the marseille game when he was playing in a similar role...

Well that shows you clearly didn't read the first page. Gerrard's "happiest" in a central midfield role. He is not, never has been and never will be a support striker. You are taking away 50% of his game playing him there. Just as you would be taking away 50% of his game playing him in a holding role.

He is not a support striker. Again, I'll say that for you, he's not a support striker. The lad tackles to well and tracks back aswell as not getting close enough to Torres, against the better sides he also doesn't get into the game as he doesn't have the intelligence to play in that role, turn and face up. He doesn't have the intelligence to find the space either.

He's a great player, he's an ok support striker. Why waste him?

[JoeTerp]

Gerrard is arguably our best player (Reina, Mascherano, Carragher, and Torres challeges him but gerrard just has a bit more of a winning factor) so give him a role he's happiest with... and this role is a free role in the hole behind Torres... we've all seen how he plays there compared to other positions... he just looks alot more happy and active during the marseille game when he was playing in a similar role...

Well that shows you clearly didn't read the first page. Gerrard's "happiest" in a central midfield role. He is not, never has been and never will be a support striker. You are taking away 50% of his game playing him there. Just as you would be taking away 50% of his game playing him in a holding role.

He is not a support striker. Again, I'll say that for you, he's not a support striker. The lad tackles to well and tracks back aswell as not getting close enough to Torres, against the better sides he also doesn't get into the game as he doesn't have the intelligence to play in that role, turn and face up. He doesn't have the intelligence to find the space either.

He's a great player, he's an ok support striker. Why waste him?

this is a slightly different issue in that it applies more to playing Gerrard on the right, but why is it important to play Gerrard in his happiest role? Rafa clearly sees nothing wrong with playing Kuyt out wide right and I am sure that is not his favorite role.  I am sure Gerrards actual happiest role would be the role of premier league trophy lifter in a red shirt, and he should really be thinking I should do whatever it takes on the pitch and play any type of role for that to happen.  If I were to ask you or most posters on this board to make an very best TEN, leaving an open spot for a mystery player And also leaving Gerrard out of the Ten, where do you think this mystery player X would be playing?  If you assume that this mystery player X would have to be the weakest link in the chain of the eleven, it would instantly turn into a strength (within reason) if Gerrard was played in that role. 

Now I am not saying that Rafa should actually do that, because Gerrard could end up playing centre half or something like that for all we know.  But the idea of picking a team in that manner is just as wrong as putting Gerrard down 1st on the team sheet in whatever his favorite role is and then building a team around him.  I would think that our best XI would be a combination of the two methods that measures the strength of any particular XI by viewing the team as a single unit.

[Fo Dne]

Gerrard is arguably our best player (Reina, Mascherano, Carragher, and Torres challeges him but gerrard just has a bit more of a winning factor) so give him a role he's happiest with... and this role is a free role in the hole behind Torres... we've all seen how he plays there compared to other positions... he just looks alot more happy and active during the marseille game when he was playing in a similar role...

Well that shows you clearly didn't read the first page. Gerrard's "happiest" in a central midfield role. He is not, never has been and never will be a support striker. You are taking away 50% of his game playing him there. Just as you would be taking away 50% of his game playing him in a holding role.

He is not a support striker. Again, I'll say that for you, he's not a support striker. The lad tackles to well and tracks back aswell as not getting close enough to Torres, against the better sides he also doesn't get into the game as he doesn't have the intelligence to play in that role, turn and face up. He doesn't have the intelligence to find the space either.

He's a great player, he's an ok support striker. Why waste him?

this is a slightly different issue in that it applies more to playing Gerrard on the right, but why is it important to play Gerrard in his happiest role? Rafa clearly sees nothing wrong with playing Kuyt out wide right and I am sure that is not his favorite role.  I am sure Gerrards actual happiest role would be the role of premier league trophy lifter in a red shirt, and he should really be thinking I should do whatever it takes on the pitch and play any type of role for that to happen.  If I were to ask you or most posters on this board to make an very best TEN, leaving an open spot for a mystery player And also leaving Gerrard out of the Ten, where do you think this mystery player X would be playing?  If you assume that this mystery player X would have to be the weakest link in the chain of the eleven, it would instantly turn into a strength (within reason) if Gerrard was played in that role. 

Now I am not saying that Rafa should actually do that, because Gerrard could end up playing centre half or something like that for all we know.  But the idea of picking a team in that manner is just as wrong as putting Gerrard down 1st on the team sheet in whatever his favorite role is and then building a team around him.  I would think that our best XI would be a combination of the two methods that measures the strength of any particular XI by viewing the team as a single unit.

Here's were you are showing a lack of understanding from a players point of view. Every player is different and has a different personality.

Some players are just happy to go in, learn, play wherever asked and just get on with it as long as they get their game, others hate being asked to play out of position as they feel they can't play to there maximum and it affects confidence. They also look at the players in there position and think, I'm better than them... etc etc. Some are more professional than others and react differently to different situations.

As a player myself, I always took it personally when I was asked to move out of central midfield and I hated it even though i was more than capable of playing centre half or on the wings. Even though we played at a differently level, we all took it seriously, hence the cup and league wins. Gerrard clearly states he feels the same way about moving out of his prefered position.

The fact is though, with players like this you have to sit them down and tell them whats what. You have to explain its purely for the balance of the team and you understand all this that and the other. Gerrard wants to play in the middle every week.

[JoeTerp]

Gerrard is arguably our best player (Reina, Mascherano, Carragher, and Torres challeges him but gerrard just has a bit more of a winning factor) so give him a role he's happiest with... and this role is a free role in the hole behind Torres... we've all seen how he plays there compared to other positions... he just looks alot more happy and active during the marseille game when he was playing in a similar role...

Well that shows you clearly didn't read the first page. Gerrard's "happiest" in a central midfield role. He is not, never has been and never will be a support striker. You are taking away 50% of his game playing him there. Just as you would be taking away 50% of his game playing him in a holding role.

He is not a support striker. Again, I'll say that for you, he's not a support striker. The lad tackles to well and tracks back aswell as not getting close enough to Torres, against the better sides he also doesn't get into the game as he doesn't have the intelligence to play in that role, turn and face up. He doesn't have the intelligence to find the space either.

He's a great player, he's an ok support striker. Why waste him?

this is a slightly different issue in that it applies more to playing Gerrard on the right, but why is it important to play Gerrard in his happiest role? Rafa clearly sees nothing wrong with playing Kuyt out wide right and I am sure that is not his favorite role.  I am sure Gerrards actual happiest role would be the role of premier league trophy lifter in a red shirt, and he should really be thinking I should do whatever it takes on the pitch and play any type of role for that to happen.  If I were to ask you or most posters on this board to make an very best TEN, leaving an open spot for a mystery player And also leaving Gerrard out of the Ten, where do you think this mystery player X would be playing?  If you assume that this mystery player X would have to be the weakest link in the chain of the eleven, it would instantly turn into a strength (within reason) if Gerrard was played in that role. 

Now I am not saying that Rafa should actually do that, because Gerrard could end up playing centre half or something like that for all we know.  But the idea of picking a team in that manner is just as wrong as putting Gerrard down 1st on the team sheet in whatever his favorite role is and then building a team around him.  I would think that our best XI would be a combination of the two methods that measures the strength of any particular XI by viewing the team as a single unit.

Here's were you are showing a lack of understanding from a players point of view. Every player is different and has a different personality.

I understand very well actually. When I played american football in school, I was the only junior who started on the offensive line, and I started at left guard, which was my best position and the next season, as a senior I was named captain of the team, but I was asked to move to center because I was pretty much the only person who was any good at all that could play there, but it was not by best position.  The person who filled in for me, that I was playing above the year before, was named to the all conference team, and honor that certianly would have gone to me instead because I was better than him at that position.  He got to play at university level, and I only got recruited by shi.te schools that I had no interest in going to.