Liverpool FC Forum

[kazza]

They'd give him away for free if he was disrupting the club.

I can only imagine you didnt mean that - if you did, then thats a stupid thing to say.

Stupid? Well there was no Paul Merson/Tony Adams style rehab and arm round your shoulder treatment for Mutu when he was caught doing the charlie. See you later mate, we'll just write off the 14 million pound transfer fee, Bye! Given away.
When Veron was surplus to requirement and it was figured that nobody would pay his salary, then the 16 million fee was written off and he was farmed off to Italy with, so rumour from a solid source has it, 3/4 of his salary paid. Given away.
Crespo? ditto ditto ditto.
Chelsea are by no means the only club to take this stance these days, we did something very similar with Diouff/Cheyrou. The fact that they can afford to do it without any problem, even when there have been massive transfer fees involved is what makes them slightly different.
So is it a silly thing to say that Chelsea would in the right circumstances give him away? Is it a silly thing to say when justifying my opinion that Cole could be prised out of Stamford Bridge for around 6 million given he isn't in their first team and he wants to play for England in Germany?
  No. Infact it's a silly thing to say that it is.

Mutu - was caught doing drugs, never came to practice, never trained, was leading a playboy lifestyle and taking it easy - club policy to dismiss such a player.

Veron - Biggest mistake ever, never settled at Manu and that should have been a clear sign that he could not play in the EPL. He is on loan and whatever the press might say no one other than the Cfc and Inter board know what the $$ deal is. I can only imagine Peter and Roman are not stupid enough to pay his wages and that Inter have sorted it out with an undisclosed fee or ever better with first option on Adriano 

Crespo - All CR's fault and I blame him 100%. He never spoke to the player, never helped him settle down in London. Never game him starts and did not trust him - his player management for Crespo was terrible and a shame. Jose came, loaned him out, got him back on form and brought him back - smart move. Not a waste of money at all and will be vital this season.

As for Cole. He is a very important player, he will get a lot of playing time and will start against Bolton this Sat.

IF (big if) he has to leave, it will not be on the cheap. Parker (who had not played for a year) left on 6.5, what makes you think Cole (who was so important last year and has improved leaps and bounds under JosE) will leave at 6? I would imagein above 10  .... maybe even 12-15 (no, im serious .. he is of that quality)

- You might be right when you say it wont effect us, as we do have a lot of money. But its against the club policy, its a stupid thing to do and its not the way Roman does business. Each penny counts and we are not just going to let go of players because they want to play more games.

So in conclusion, it might not be silly to think that 6M wont effect us (in a technical bank balance way), but its silly to think Joe can be bought for 6, or that we would ever let him go on free - silly.

smellpee forever, why are we talking about your club?

[Chelsea forever.]

We are not talking about my club.

I am having a conversation with bigmik about a player called Joe Cole who plays for Chelsea and who interests bigmik - we are talking about how much he is worth and weather or not the club would let him go on free.

[JC_81]

Crespo - All CR's fault and I blame him 100%. He never spoke to the player, never helped him settle down in London. Never game him starts and did not trust him - his player management for Crespo was terrible and a shame. Jose came, loaned him out, got him back on form and brought him back - smart move. Not a waste of money at all and will be vital this season.

Smart move by Mourinho?

Think you're giving him too much credit there.  He loaned out Crespo without giving him a chance because he thought Drogba was going to be the next big thing.  Then after a season it became clear that Drogba wasn't that great and in fact that centre-forward was Chelsea's weakest position.  So Mourinho enquires about Eto'o, Shevchenko, Trezequet and a host of other strikers.  None of them want to sign, so he is left with his ONLY other option, which is to bring back Crespo against his wishes.

So basically, yes Chelsea are better with Crespo in the squad, but no, this isn't down to a 'smart move' by Mourinho, he had no choice.

[bigmick]

One word Mick, xenophobia.

   
I can only think you have not read the post mate to be totally honest. Please read it again.

I agree with Andy about sticking to the point. I personally wouldn't particularly fancy Cole, I mentioned him merely to demonstrate there are similar players already playing over here to ones which we have signed. If you re-read the original post I did actually mention that I prefer Garcia, so Chels's predictable attempt to turn the discussion onto all things Bridgelike won't succeed with me. They would sell him for peanuts is  my point if he disrupted the club and I think I answered the question on that one.
I have long been an advocate of Ledley King however. If we are looking to buy two wide men then we could consider Downing and Zoltan Gera from WBA. If we are looking for a quick, thoughtful striker to play alongside a big man upfront, we could consider Andy Johnson. All currently Prem based and worth a look. Not however all British so I hope I've settled the ridiculous and frankly quite insulting xenophobia thing once and for all.

[kazza]

We are not talking about my club.

I am having a conversation with bigmik about ....

How about this? I made you a template so you can start your threads. Start with the quote, then go on to talk about your sh1t club because that is how it seems to pan out.

Smellpee Forever, everyone here hates your club. You continue to represent them on a LFC forum and you are bating everyone. Fans like you are irrelavent because you flip flop teams depending on who is winning (I am willing to bet that a couple of years ago you supported Arsenal, and at least they played good football). Your opinion is irrelavent because as the wind will change, then so will your loyalties. How can someone like that ever be taken seriously?

[darwisigila]

yeah...u right. it about joe cole and not yo boring souless chelshite..i don care if chelshite not interested to release j cole or not coz i don want  anfield become like Stamford Boringness. chelshite may have plenty of flair and skill player but just look how they played...Waiting their oppenent to make mistake...

[kazza]

One word Mick, xenophobia.

   

It was more a joke Mick, but to some on here it is true. I did read your post, and see your point.

I think the pool of foreign players is greater, so the illusion is you can get players much cheaper. Trouble is when a premiership club comes around to buy a foreign player, they seem to get quoted premiership prices so in that respect you are better off with local players, as they need no time to adapt.

Bottom line however is you are far more likely to find a star on the cheap abraoad.

[Sabre]

I agree the analysis. Completely.

You know, 10 years ago with all the digital tv thingy, the tv platforms paid a lot of money to every club for the rights. With so much money in their hands, Spanish teams wasted the money. Real Sociedad, a team traditionally based on his youth system, was buying expensive-useless south Koreans seeking dunnowhat financial bussiness. Players of expensive leagues came to Spain, such as, McManaman, who being an ok player, he's quite limited TBH. Even the most humble team had 6 foreigners.

And this was a mistake. It was a mistake both for the teams, and for the national squad.

IMHO the money is in the premiere now, and they are making the same mistake. Yes, Alonso and Reyes might provide something there's not in england. But Ivan Campo? Josemi? Nuñez? there must be houndreds of brittish players better than them, and it is a Spaniard who is saying this, nothing to do with Xenophobia. On the long term, if positions with responsabilities are occupied by foreign players, the England national squad will notice it. Besides, Spaniards are expensive. More than one Spanish teams are desiring that the new riches of England buy their wannabe players for a prize nobody would pay here any more.

Sabre

[JBG]

I hear what you are saying Mick. The problem is that English players at the top end of the spectrum are grossly over rated and have hugely inflated transfer valuations. Rio Ferdinand is a good player but he aint worth £30million plus, no way. SWP is a very god little player but at £20millio, Man City are laughing all the way to the bank. There is talk of Real Madrid and Barcelona lining up £40million bids for Frank Lampard. That to me, is an absolute farce. Lampard, along with Ferdinand, is one of the most over rated players in the world. Frank is a very good player going through a purple patch but he is more akin to a David Platt than to a Paul Gascoigne or a Bryan Robson. He has his limitations (he isn't really a proper midfield player like Ballack, Alonso, Kaka or Makelele who really influence games with their tackling and passing) but the London press have hyped him beyond all reasonableness. Ever see him play for England?

However, there are players at the mid level whom we should consider taking a punt at. For some reason Paul Robinson was overlooked when he left Leeds. Man UTD and Arsenal could have solved their goalkeeping problem for the next ten years for a mere £2.5million. Instead he went to Spurs. Michael Carrick is a very good player, and at Liverpool, Man UTD or Arsenal, he could go on to be a regular for England. Man UTD are crying out for midfielders, so why did they pass up on Carrick? Even if he didn't make the grade you are only talking of an outlay of £3million, most of which you'd get back if you sold him. Damien Francis of Wigan is also a good point. He didn't cost Wigan much, and he could go on to be a very good player. A top 6 club could have bought him and gave him a shot at the big time. The risk is mininal: he either makes it and if he doesn't, someone like Wigan or Southampton would take him off your hands for a few quid.

Jermaine Defoe joined Spurs for £7million while we spent £14million on Cisse. For me, Defoe is easily the better player.

I ain't on for going all out and blowing £20million on Ledley King (thats the fee we'd potentially pay if, say, Arsenal or even Chelsea became interested) as I think we could probably get a very good foreigner for half of that, but there is no harm at looking at the less hyped English players.

[kazza]

Sabre, I saw you un edited post. I am English and I see it, not personal just the truth.

[Chelsea forever.]

Smart move by Mourinho?

Think you're giving him too much credit there.  He loaned out Crespo without giving him a chance because he thought Drogba was going to be the next big thing.  Then after a season it became clear that Drogba wasn't that great and in fact that centre-forward was Chelsea's weakest position.  So Mourinho enquires about Eto'o, Shevchenko, Trezequet and a host of other strikers.  None of them want to sign, so he is left with his ONLY other option, which is to bring back Crespo against his wishes.

So basically, yes Chelsea are better with Crespo in the squad, but no, this isn't down to a 'smart move' by Mourinho, he had no choice.

JC -

He loaned out Crespo because

(1) Crespo was very unhappy when Jose arrived as he had not been given a chance
(2) Milan were guranteeing him 1st team football
(3) We had Drogba + Guddy + Kezman + Mika all for a 4-3-3 system with only 1 striker

So Jose made a very smart move in 'loaning' him to a big club. This way he would get a good year of football at the highest quality, and if Kezman wouldnt pay off (which he didnt) we could bring a fully fit Crespo back. Kezman did not play well, Mika was  still injured and has not dont anything much for Brum (as much as i love mika) and Guddy is playing in MF. So we now have Drogba and a fit happy and on form Crespo for 1 spot. Id call that a smart move.

Just for the record, the media can say all they want, they linked you with almost all the wingers and CB's they could find - doesnt mean you bid for all of them.

We never made a bid for Trez or Eto'o. As for Sheva the story goes that Roman is good friends with him and he told Roman that he is not looking at a move away from Milan - we never made a formal 60M bid. It would be stupid on our part to bid that kind of money when the player who is a friend of Romans has clearly stated he does not want a move.

If you re-read the original post I did actually mention that I prefer Garcia, so Chels's predictable attempt to turn the discussion onto all things Bridgelike won't succeed with me

bigmik - it was never an attempt to turn anything Bridgelike. I quoted your one line and responded with a single sentance saying "I can only imagine you didnt mean that - if you did, then thats a stupid thing to say.

Joe Cole is a very important player for us, there is no way we will sell him .. he has a vital role to play at Chelsea and he loves the club." the rest of my post was about English players.

Then "darwisigila " said he is better than Garcia to which i replied he was and continued with my post on your quote.

And to end this subject - we will not let him go for peanuts - thats my view and you have yours. Fair and accepted, only time will tell 'IF' he leaves and on what terms he does.

But to for you to think Joe or Glen would swap Chelsea for Liverpool is a bit rich, even if they would be happy to be playing more games. - Nothing against LIverpool as a club, but you know what im talking about.

Kazza- Im sorry if you get offended. This is just discussion on player and has nothing to do with me wanting to talk about Chelsea.

--

Further on the topic.

Rafa is a cool bloke and there is nothing wrong with him importing talent. But what he is doing to Liverpool is not good IMO, you DO need a spine of more than Gerrard and Carra.

King and Defoe are good players, as is Carrick. But SPurs are building ATM and look a serious side. Jol has made a smart move with his players and to think they would let go of any of their English contingent (Robinson, Carrick, Defoe, King) would not be wise.

[kazza]

Kazza- Im sorry if you get offended. This is just discussion on player and has nothing to do with me wanting to talk about Chelsea.

[stmichael]

the SWP deal move to chelsea is the most recent example of english players being overpriced. as good a player as SWP is, chelsea paid more for him than real madrid paid for robinho.

there are english players out there in the lower leagues who are capable of making the step up to a higher level. however a lot of the so called "top managers" are reluctant to take a chance on these guys incase it doesn't come off and they harm their reputations as a result.

[Chelsea forever.]

However,

A lot would have to do with Rafa being new in England. He might have his players in mind and want to build a team on his thoughts. He might not know much about English players - but this is were I would imagine the Club to step in.

Another factor might be that he wants already established players, Carrick still has a lot of work to do. King is not going to be sold and I would imagine a bumper fee of about 18-20M for Defoe - something Rafa would never do.

There are young players to look at - Bent, Ferdinand, Gray, Thomas and its only time before a few big clubs snap them up. Ferdinand might follow Rio to Manu, Newcastle or Spurs or even Boro might look at the others. I doubt Wenger is intersted and im not too sure Jose is either.

If Cisse is to go (which looks likely) then Bent would be the perfect buy - big man little man story with him and Crouch.

[drummerphil]

MORNING CHELSEA FOREVER,DIDNT YOU POST A RATHER OFFENSIVE MESSAGE ON HERE TO ME,SAYING YOU WERE LEAVING AND NEVER COMING BACK,NOT EVEN WHEN WE PLAY YOU.

MMMMMMMMM  Seems even your threats to leave are empty lies