Liverpool FC Forum

[Homebooby]

I wish they would stop fannying about with the ball at the back and putting ourselves
under presssure.

Sometimes its fine to knock it down the side, win a throw and play your football in that
half of the field.

At Old Trafford today I was more concerned when our own player Reina had the ball at
his feet than when United were moving with it through midfield.

thats his philosophy and its never going to change.
i agree we tend to overpass it and get ourselves into trouble but that isnt the biggest issue i have with it, its how pedestrian and slow we are to bring it forward is what kills me.

I think it comes down to lack of quality than the tactic/style itself The problem is half the team doesn't know how to put an accurate and incisive ball forward.

[red till i die!!]

I wish they would stop fannying about with the ball at the back and putting ourselves
under presssure.

Sometimes its fine to knock it down the side, win a throw and play your football in that
half of the field.

At Old Trafford today I was more concerned when our own player Reina had the ball at
his feet than when United were moving with it through midfield.

thats his philosophy and its never going to change.
i agree we tend to overpass it and get ourselves into trouble but that isnt the biggest issue i have with it, its how pedestrian and slow we are to bring it forward is what kills me.

I think it comes down to lack of quality than the tactic/style itself The problem is half the team doesn't know how to put an accurate and incisive ball forward.

its the philosophy, its all about pass,move and walk it up the field using triangles.
he isnt interested in long balls or defence splitting passes to set your front men in a position where they can stretch the centre halfs or be one on one with the keeper.
thats partly the reason on why we dont have a plan B.
he isnt interested in a target man and you dont have to even be a physical player because if you are moving the ball in the triangles quick enough it eliminates the need for contact.

[Thommo's perm]

we threw 3 points away there, we picked the most negative midfield we`ve got to try and contain probably the weakest man united side we`ve played against in a quarter of a century.
look at their midfield today - carrick, cleverly, young and kawaga.....i bet liverpool players of the recent past who had to line up against the likes of keane, ince, giggs and kanchelskis or later on the likes of scholes, beckham, ronaldo and giggs wished they had played against a united midfield like that in their day.
even their defence, ferdinand and evra are way past their best and vidic has been out a year with a cruciate injury, their keeper is always likely to flap at a cross or drop a clanger as well. we werent playing against the japp stams, gary pallisters and peter schmeichels who conceded a goal every blue moon today.
rodgers has done well in recent weeks but he blew that game the moment he handed in our teamsheet.
i`m convinced if he would have had started with sturridge instead of sterling and hendo instead of allen we`d have won today and thrown the race for fourth and the title race wide open.
frustrating as f##k!

I agree!
I admit I am biased but them cu'nts have got no-one except Van Persie who is world class. Rodgers fu'cked up big time by bottling it in the midfield and not playing Sturridge from the start. Why are people worrying about his fitness? Play him for an hour and bring him off after the damage is done for fu'cks sake!
Does anyone honestly think 45 minutes extra rest will make any difference?

[mart]

I think it comes down to lack of quality than the tactic/style itself The problem is half the team doesn't know how to put an accurate and incisive ball forward.

Ofcourse it comes down to the tactic used. If we dont have the technical ability to pass the ball around like barca then why is he telling the team to do it? Its most obvious in defense, and we are lucky we did not gift them a few more goals with the shaky passing in our own half.

[ycsatbjywtbiastkamb]

we threw 3 points away there, we picked the most negative midfield we`ve got to try and contain probably the weakest man united side we`ve played against in a quarter of a century.
look at their midfield today - carrick, cleverly, young and kawaga.....i bet liverpool players of the recent past who had to line up against the likes of keane, ince, giggs and kanchelskis or later on the likes of scholes, beckham, ronaldo and giggs wished they had played against a united midfield like that in their day.
even their defence, ferdinand and evra are way past their best and vidic has been out a year with a cruciate injury, their keeper is always likely to flap at a cross or drop a clanger as well. we werent playing against the japp stams, gary pallisters and peter schmeichels who conceded a goal every blue moon today.
rodgers has done well in recent weeks but he blew that game the moment he handed in our teamsheet.
i`m convinced if he would have had started with sturridge instead of sterling and hendo instead of allen we`d have won today and thrown the race for fourth and the title race wide open.
frustrating as f##k!

I agree!
I admit I am biased but them cu'nts have got no-one except Van Persie who is world class. Rodgers fu'cked up big time by bottling it in the midfield and not playing Sturridge from the start. Why are people worrying about his fitness? Play him for an hour and bring him off after the damage is done for fu'cks sake!
Does anyone honestly think 45 minutes extra rest will make any difference?

mate, why the f##k were we set up to try and contain a central midfield pairing of carrick and cleverly?
and look who they had out wide - ashley young and kawaga! hardly tom finney and stanley matthews.
i wouldnt mind but here are we are picking our most negative midfield combination at a time when their defence is leaking goals like a sieve, even newcastle who are in freefall scored 3 against them at old trafford.
when we finally started having a go at them after sturridge came on they could hardly get out of their own half, ferguson was throwing defenders on like they were going out of fashion to try to contain us. even then we were still creating good chances (sturridge should have buried that other chance he had).
i cant believe that game today, i honestly think the 3 points were there for the taking but we blew it by being intimidated by them.
hopefully rodgers has learned a lesson from today.

[Kenny Kan]

I made the mistake of advocating we contain them, I think Rodgers went with this approach for the first half. Realistically though, we didn't contain them at all and played that approach very badly. It's good in one respect because it does show Rodgers is a thinker and will adapt and be flexible if need be. Yet, playing a containing game (if that is what that first half's performance was supposed to be) with a 4-3-3 isn't ideal, I know now, I've seen first hand.

I think the other people who advocated 'going for them' straight from the off, in hindsight were right. I just remember the Benitez/Houllier eras when we used to contain teams like united and get results but that style doesn't fit with what Rodgers is trying to do, like a hand to glove.

I think we should persist with the 4-3-3. I've seen other posters advocating the drop of this formation and at a time when Borini and Sturridge are ready to come in and do a job, I couldn't think of a worst time to drop the 4-3-3. We need to see how it works with some proper strikers (or the right personal) before we start screaming for changes in formation.

I'm stuck on the midfield as with regards to our issues, like a broken record. I think our defense would be fine if midfield covered them better and I think our strikers would reap more reward if they were getting fed better and more consistent passages of play.

The problem with 3 in midfield (IMO) is of course the numbers and the players that make up that trio. Defensively I think we're more exposed BUT with our game being based on possession lesser teams should not have enough ball to damage us but this is not the same when (said teams) we're talking about make quick breaks or counter attacks against us. So, It is something to be wary of but with the right person in our midfield it would shore us up and give us a bit more steel.

I think we have too many 'nearly' midfielders. Take Henderson's, Lucas', Allen's and Shelvey's individual abilities and combine them, then you would have an all round finished midfielder. As it is, each midfielder lacks something the other has and I think this is detriment to the team - big time. We need an athletic reinforcer with significant physical presence who can get up and down that pitch all day long. Coupled with the ability to make bone crunching tackles and who can cause a bit of havoc going forward - is there any such midfielder? Momo Sissoko is the closest I can think of (I don't watch other players and teams so I wouldn't know, although that Diame fella at West Ham looked alright), like that but his touch and control for a pass are much like Shelvey's, in fact they're probably worse.

Midfield is THE issue IMHO.

Also, when Sturridge came on yesterday, I personally didn't like the idea that Suarez was moved back into the hole - as the advanced midfielder. Leaving two genuine midfielders to cope and moving Suarez away from the oppo's box. Suarez needs IMO to stay right up top, be it centrally or next to Sturridge, flanking him.

Like this:

                        Suarez............Sturridge...........Borinin

Not like this:

                        Borini............Strurridge...........Downing/Sterling

                                                      Suarez

Suarez has become an advanced midfielder and with his attacking instincts played that bit deeper (to no real effect IMO) we've suddenly become a 4-2-4 formation,  and that's fecking dodgy. Even though this formation isn't rigid and it offers players to move and become more fluid we've essentially got 4 attack minded players there who aren't the best at tracking back, tackling and doing a bit of midfield work.

Ideally I'd like to see this, if Rodgers bought in THE RIGHT midfielder (oh no, not another central midfielder I hear you say) but we need the right personel and I still don't think we've got it yet.

                    Suarez.......Sturridge.............Borini

                                           Gerrard

                                Diame             Lucas

              Enrique           Agger        Skertel          Johnson

                                             Reina

[Octsky]

45 min of sturridge vs manyoo convinced me that suarez and sturridge will form a devastating partnership. our 2 SS will destroy teams. plus borri, they will form a great trinity attack. just like the brazil 3 Rs (ronaldo, rivaldo, ronaldino) but of coz too a lesser extend.

[stmichael]

the 2nd half just emphasised that from now on our best bet is just to take the bull by the horns and go pretty much all out attack. i say this mainly because it negates the major weaknesses which we have in the side.


certainly with our next game being norwich at home i'd like to see us try 4-4-2 for once with suarez and sturridge up top.

[Thommo's perm]

the 2nd half just emphasised that from now on our best bet is just to take the bull by the horns and go pretty much all out attack. i say this mainly because it negates the major weaknesses which we have in the side.


certainly with our next game being norwich at home i'd like to see us try 4-4-2 for once with suarez and sturridge up top.

If Rodgers doesnt play the team that finished the man u match from the start against Norwich then weve got problems...

[RedHands]

Horses for courses. We have been dominating the also-rans of the premier league with the 4-3-3. I think we should stick to it against Norwich with Sturridge starting instead of downing.

[LFC1990]

Gordon Strachan ran this point yesterday at the spurs game but not about us,

We have added to our squad but not added quality. We may have a 25 man squad but do not have the quality to cope with injuries, Suspensions, Rotations. The last two games proved that with Sturridge it showed me missed him.

ALot of people spoke about how a forward would change us as a team and to be fair when sturridge came in it showed.

Henderson has come on leaps and bounds and at the moment is our most consistent performer. I expect Reina, Skrtel and obviously carra to leave come the summer.

All 3 will need replacing and not from our youth academy. I know we dont have citys money but their defence Kompany Lescott Nastasic Kolarov Clichy Richards Zabaleta MAicon.

Comapre it with ours after you get past the Johnson Agger Carragher Enrique you get young guys Robinson Coates Flannagan and Wisdom.

WE also have skrtel who hasnt performed and Kelly constantly injured

The same goes throughout our side Remove Gerrard Henderson( who is still young) and Lucas you get Shelvey Suso and Allen Young In experienced at a top side.

Down to the strikers Suarez Sturridge and arguably Downing you get Raheem who has drifted off Borini without being given a chance doesnt really set the world on fire and we havent seen alot of coutinho although for inter v spurs he was quality.

Summer will be important Rodgers needs to find a starting 11 and build a squad worthy of competition.

For example to replace the players i expect to go from our starting 11 say we bring in Begovic and Hangelaand, who im a big fan of. That would not break the bank especially as we would be getting some kind of fee for Skrtel and Reina

Diame who has a buy out clause of 3m.

We then have a starting 11 who teams will be fearing

                         Begovic
Johnson   Hangelaand  Agger   Enrique

                  Diame    Lucas

                         Gerrard
Coutinho                               Suarez
                        Sturridge

That arguably on the day can beat any side.

our bench can consist of the likes of Kelly Downing Henderson players that can go into that team and still not fear if they would mess up.

Whatever budget is left which still should be alot Only buy players that will make the grade at Liverpool not young promising stars. We have alot of them.

I hope the sale of Carroll could swing the Diame deal in our favour

[heimdall]

Gordon Strachan ran this point yesterday at the spurs game but not about us,

We have added to our squad but not added quality. We may have a 25 man squad but do not have the quality to cope with injuries, Suspensions, Rotations. The last two games proved that with Sturridge it showed me missed him.

ALot of people spoke about how a forward would change us as a team and to be fair when sturridge came in it showed.

Henderson has come on leaps and bounds and at the moment is our most consistent performer. I expect Reina, Skrtel and obviously carra to leave come the summer.

All 3 will need replacing and not from our youth academy. I know we dont have citys money but their defence Kompany Lescott Nastasic Kolarov Clichy Richards Zabaleta MAicon.

Comapre it with ours after you get past the Johnson Agger Carragher Enrique you get young guys Robinson Coates Flannagan and Wisdom.

WE also have skrtel who hasnt performed and Kelly constantly injured

The same goes throughout our side Remove Gerrard Henderson( who is still young) and Lucas you get Shelvey Suso and Allen Young In experienced at a top side.

Down to the strikers Suarez Sturridge and arguably Downing you get Raheem who has drifted off Borini without being given a chance doesnt really set the world on fire and we havent seen alot of coutinho although for inter v spurs he was quality.

Summer will be important Rodgers needs to find a starting 11 and build a squad worthy of competition.

For example to replace the players i expect to go from our starting 11 say we bring in Begovic and Hangelaand, who im a big fan of. That would not break the bank especially as we would be getting some kind of fee for Skrtel and Reina

Diame who has a buy out clause of 3m.

We then have a starting 11 who teams will be fearing

                         Begovic
Johnson   Hangelaand  Agger   Enrique

                  Diame    Lucas

                         Gerrard
Coutinho                               Suarez
                        Sturridge

That arguably on the day can beat any side.

our bench can consist of the likes of Kelly Downing Henderson players that can go into that team and still not fear if they would mess up.

Whatever budget is left which still should be alot Only buy players that will make the grade at Liverpool not young promising stars. We have alot of them.

I hope the sale of Carroll could swing the Diame deal in our favour

You're making  a big assumption that Suarez/Sturridge will still be here next season, I very much doubt they will be.

[red till i die!!]

our tactic's or tactic is very poor imo and all it does is restrict us and makes us way too obvious against any half organised team. where is the high pressing tempo that was supposed to be the cornerstone of our play gone ?.
our signings have been absolute cack with the exception of sturridge and if kenny had of succeeded in getting him when he was here i believe he would still be in the job. why did we sign borini when he wont play him?, wtf was the sahin and assaidi signings about ? assaidi is never a premier league player. joe allen is a big fish from a small pond thats drowning and we were absolutely ripped off with what we paid.
we can blame fsg all we want but they are not the ones that signed these players rodgers did. they might want players that have a resale value but it was the manager who picked these players not them because he wouldnt have that. they will be looking to see what value he has got for their money and the truth is that he hasnt got any and none are worth more than what we paid.
we are continuing to break all the wrong records and it will continue unless rodgers learns to become more adaptable in his signings and tactics. im pretty sure behind all the arrogance he knows fine well they will can him as quick as they hired him.
mentally we are very weak and looking at our season so far id question whether or not he has the full support of all the players. he was willing to let henderson go for free, slated downing in the media and also enrique without first having a word with them. i dont think skyrtel is behind him and reina either for that matter.
we face a massive test this summer to get things right because another season like this wont be tolerated and then the hill we were supposed to be climbing will turn into everest.

[ycsatbjywtbiastkamb]

i watched barcelona earlier and i have to say before messi came on i thought they looked very ordinary, it`s not the first time i`ve noticed this either, i`ve seen it happen quite a few times in league games when they rest him.
is this philosophy all it`s cracked up to be? maybe barcelona`s success is simply down to them having one of the all time greats in their line up, not the style of play.
are we p1$$ing in the wind here? are we chasing an impossible dream? can we replicate their success without having the class of players they have?

[kazza]

i watched barcelona earlier and i have to say before messi came on i thought they looked very ordinary, it`s not the first time i`ve noticed this either, i`ve seen it happen quite a few times in league games when they rest him.
is this philosophy all it`s cracked up to be? maybe barcelona`s success is simply down to them having one of the all time greats in their line up, not the style of play.
are we p1$$ing in the wind here? are we chasing an impossible dream? can we replicate their success without having the class of players they have?

I have said this a number of times. They sure are fun to watch but it is the playes that are awesome not just the system. To win the prem you have to be king of the 1-0 not the 4-3. The teams that win have the best defence not the most attractive football to watch. Even when Utd were at their best they were a very solid defence with some fast counter-attacking players. Barcelona are an anomaly and we should not be basing our system on that, it is naive!