Liverpool FC Forum

[mark the red]

i like the way stu using football manager 2006/'made them up' stats to back his arguement up, is he having a laugh? what a dignified way to qualify his arguement

as for gerrard leaving gaps in the midfield, we have alonso, didi and sissoko who can mop up and let him play to his strengths, get a grip will you stu.  one man doesnt make a team, no matter how good gerrard is, he still needs to help of others, and his drive going foward is complimented well by anyone of our defensive midfielders, if anything they are there to give gerrard license to roam, hence benefiting the team.  and for the record there is not one thing (techinically) that barton is better than gerrard at, apart from assaulting kids and breaking team mates feet

[115-1073096938]

i like the way stu using football manager 2006/'made them up' stats to back his arguement up, is he having a laugh? what a dignified way to qualify his arguement

as for gerrard leaving gaps in the midfield, we have alonso, didi and sissoko who can mop up and let him play to his strengths, get a grip will you stu.  one man doesnt make a team, no matter how good gerrard is, he still needs to help of others, and his drive going foward is complimented well by anyone of our defensive midfielders, if anything they are there to give gerrard license to roam, hence benefiting the team.  and for the record there is not one thing (techinically) that barton is better than gerrard at, apart from assaulting kids and breaking team mates feet

Don't know your from your elbow lad. Simple as that.

Talking about me as the third person will get you no-where and won't win you any friends on here.

The fact you've probably read about 20 out of 4000 an odd posts i've made shows you're again, making a judement on something you know very little about.

I strongly suggest you look at me "opinions" on things in the past and players such as Carragher, Baros, Ashton, Hyypia, Finnan, i had similar abuse from members such as yourself saying how clueless i was when i called those players.

Your arguement is poor, your attitude a joke and your lack of knowledge amusing.

Get a clue, learn about football, attend a few matches, learn about tactical movement, technical ability, speak to knowledgable people, coach the best kids side in the country, play at a decent, watch a few players live, play against some professional's, then come back.

[115-1073096938]

i like the way stu using football manager 2006

Do you know how that game or games such as that came about?

FC Barcelona had a database with every player in the top three leagues of world football on. They had every stat available, they sent scouts and managers to watch and assess them and look at all there strengths and weaknesses.

It was then put into a database with each individual skill, that was then used to assess players by Barcelona and they would refere to that using the database.

This is now common practise amoungst nearly EVERY SINGLE CLUB in the top leagues in world football. It varies greatly amoung certain clubs, but the system is pretty much the same. Hence the reason Benitez knew so much about Liverpool FC and players we'd never heard of ourselves.

[mark the red]

attend a few games?, im at all the home games, aways if i can make them, play footy once or twice a week. that will do for me, i dont know how much more you want me to do, you seem to have achieved a lot or tell people you do anyway, i sense a little bit of bull ' . the fact remains you talk when it comes to barton

[mark the red]

i like the way stu using football manager 2006

Do you know how that game or games such as that came about?

FC Barcelona had a database with every player in the top three leagues of world football on. They had every stat available, they sent scouts and managers to watch and assess them and look at all there strengths and weaknesses.

It was then put into a database with each individual skill, that was then used to assess players by Barcelona and they would refere to that using the database.

This is now common practise amoungst nearly EVERY SINGLE CLUB in the top leagues in world football. It varies greatly amoung certain clubs, but the system is pretty much the same. Hence the reason Benitez knew so much about Liverpool FC and players we'd never heard of ourselves.

not too convinced by that, it doesnt take into consideration a number of things(i.e. the bother a player like barton causes) and statistics are all that reliable to be fair, there is room for variation between the people who mark players on that criteria

backing your arguement up with stats is useless when it is clear that barton is nowhere near the calibre of stevie g

[El Nino_#9]

OMG, is this arguement still going on?!?!?!

[Squigels]

For what its worth 17 passing and 16 technique are a little high for Barton.

Its a novel was to compare players a first.

I don't even support Liverpool but gerrard is the best at what he does (Box to Box) midfielder around no qualms about saying he is better then Lampard.

The database systems in all seriousness are getting better in fairness but they struggle with young players and the fact players improve and so on. There out of date when they come out Fm2006 which is an ace game was out in November in theory it should be out of date now and players are better in those games on each save you play. Don't believe me go to the Championship Managar database on the C.D look for attributes such as potential and starting ability if varied the player either becomes or good.

Barton has no shot and no skill yet is considered to be very good in both attributes by the manager.

[Woollyback]

database? i thought we were playing top trumps?

[ynwa]

he might be good for city but city is a sh it team

[115-1073096938]

For what its worth 17 passing and 16 technique are a little high for Barton.

Its a novel was to compare players a first.

I don't even support Liverpool but gerrard is the best at what he does (Box to Box) midfielder around no qualms about saying he is better then Lampard.

The database systems in all seriousness are getting better in fairness but they struggle with young players and the fact players improve and so on. There out of date when they come out Fm2006 which is an ace game was out in November in theory it should be out of date now and players are better in those games on each save you play. Don't believe me go to the Championship Managar database on the C.D look for attributes such as potential and starting ability if varied the player either becomes or good.

Barton has no shot and no skill yet is considered to be very good in both attributes by the manager.

I'm not on about what they give Barton, thats how i see the lad.

The point is, these databases the clubs have contain every bit of information possible about a player. They all have them.

They are more detailed than Champ Manager.

[bigmick]

I think this argument illustrates for me perfectly why I don't like the CM stat way of judging players. You end up arguing about whether player A can control it better with his left foot than player B, which one has a better chip and which can do "the eyes" best when one on one with the keeper.
In fairness to Stu he isn't saying that Barton is a better player than Gerrard, merely that he is better at certain things. I'm pretty sure I disagree with any stat which indicates that Barton is any way equal to Gerrard but the Man City man is certainly a much improved player of that there is no doubt. He's not a right midfielder so the initial topic-starter is a bit off, but equally it is fair to say that Barton is a rapidly improving player who would get in most sides in the Premiership tomorrow. My suspicion is that his transfer request was prompted by a tap-up, and if I was a detective I would be beginning my enquiries at Arsenal. Equally Manure could do a lot worse in their search for a holding midfielder.

Stu's forthright opinions and percieved arrogance can rub some up the wrong way on occasions but needlessly so IMHO. I don't always agree with him but I do respect his opinion more than a lot of people who get on here. Also he's not afraid of swimming against the tide which is quite refreshing sometimes. FWIW I think his line about Barton having equal if not better technical ability was at best a poor choice of words and at worst a rank misjudgement, but attempts to discredit the fella totally will largely fall on deaf ears on here. They will with me anyhow.

[ynwa]

he wont to us. what will he bring to us at liverpool. he is only good because man city are a team

[Scottbot]

I like the way Barton has been playing this season. I watched the highlights of a game City lost 5-2 (can't remember who it was against) and Barton was absolutely everywhere, the best player on the park. He looks to me like he is finally turning into a player but it's still early doors and he's only really been at this level these past few months. My oldest mate is a season ticket holder at City and he has been raving about the lad all season.

Stu - I didn't really study the individual stats you put together because i don't (can't) believe you have seen enough of Barton in the flesh (or Ashton for that matter) to have been able to come to any really credible conclusions on the talent/characterisitcs of either player. For me, Barton is a good player who could become a fine player if he continues to progress as he has done this season. Claiming Barton is as good, if not better than Stevie in terms of technical ability is folly. I mean what is technical ability? Touch, control, adressing the ball, ability to turn, pass. Barton has a long long way to go in this department.

[Scottbot]

Stu - I didn't really study the individual stats you put together because i don't (can't) believe you have seen enough of Barton in the flesh (or Ashton for that matter) to have been able to come to any really credible conclusions on the talent/characterisitcs of either player.

At least not to this extent anyhow.

[H_K_LFC]

LOL   wot an argument...

Barton is not better than Gerrard but a certainly wouldnt mind seeing him at anfield...maybe even as a replacement for Didi even though we have sissoko Barton is a good utiltity player...

Could well be a decent signing