Liverpool FC Forum

[Sabre]

its understandable, players like him who rely on stamina and a acceleration dont keep "it" over the age of 28/29 ish at that level

I have read it again, but I keep disagreeing mate.

I think the best of any player, comes with 27. At 28, you could say you're going upwards no more, but you're very close to your peak if not in the very peak of your football.

I still think that what we're witnessing is a consequence of the context of the team, and other factors, not a consequence of starting to see the goodbye of Gerrard as a player.

So I respect your opinion, but I still disagree it.

[LittleHobo]

its understandable, players like him who rely on stamina and a acceleration dont keep "it" over the age of 28/29 ish at that level

I have read it again, but I keep disagreeing mate.

I think the best of any player, comes with 27. At 28, you could say you're going upwards no more, but you're very close to your peak if not in the very peak of your football.

I still think that what we're witnessing is a consequence of the context of the team, and other factors, not a consequence of starting to see the goodbye of Gerrard as a player.

So I respect your opinion, but I still disagree it.

respect back

we will see who is right over the coming year

i really hope its not me, cause i love gerrard.

[stmichael]

i'm sick of hearing that he's sick of playing with inferior players around him. the fact is he captain's the greatest club in the world and even if his form is poor the very least i'd expect is a bit of effort to turn things around. using others deficiencies as an excuse for his poor form is pathetic imo.

[Ben Patrick]

i'm sick of hearing that he's sick of playing with inferior players around him. the fact is he captain's the greatest club in the world and even if his form is poor the very least i'd expect is a bit of effort to turn things around. using others deficiencies as an excuse for his poor form is pathetic imo.

can nobody understand how frustrating it would be to come close to the league you crave so much like he did last season.
And then to lose a key player and see him replaced by someone that is not fit and totally unsuitable.
He (Gerrard) is at a stage in his career now where if he doesnt win the league soon he never will.
I believe he lost faith in the manager a long time ago, as did Carragher.
These are real people with emotion and frustration.
They are desperate for us to succeed and are playing in a side and with players around them that are not up to it.
Yes he has done that at the end of the houllier reign, but reading Carraghers book he said that when Rafa first took control and came to visit them in Portugal they were surprised that he didnt realise things were that bad.
And at this stage in his career it must be even harder to deal with this.
I think they are in a similar situation now and only a change of manager can sort this out.

[JC_81]

Agree in part with both of you actually.

I can completely understand how frustrated Gerrard is.  But at the same time it is poor form for a captain to sulk about things to the point where his form actually suffers, and that is what has happened here.  Hopefully he'll snap out of it soon, because we badly need him to start performing.

But we also can't lose sight of what a good player he is and how lucky we have been to keep him here for so long.  If he wanted to go abroad now I wouldn't hold it against him, because he has given us his best years and to be fair to him it doesn't look like we're any closer to winning the league.

Eventually he'll be regarded as our best player of all time.  He hasn't won the titles of some of the past greats, but he's kept this club going, at times single handedly for almost a decade.  It doesn't bear thinking about where we'd be now if we'd never had him, so let's keep a bit of perspective on the Gerrard issue.

[Bad Bob]

But we also can't lose sight of what a good player he is and how lucky we have been to keep him here for so long.  If he wanted to go abroad now I wouldn't hold it against him, because he has given us his best years and to be fair to him it doesn't look like we're any closer to winning the league.

Eventually he'll be regarded as our best player of all time.  He hasn't won the titles of some of the past greats, but he's kept this club going, at times single handedly for almost a decade.  It doesn't bear thinking about where we'd be now if we'd never had him, so let's keep a bit of perspective on the Gerrard issue.

Amen.  There's an awful lot of blinkered nonsense being chatted in this thread, IMO.  Gerrard isn't past it in a footballing sense and I don't buy into all the 'Stevie Me' stuff either.  I'm actually dismayed how easily some sections of the support are so ready to stick to the boot into a lad who has done everything for the club since childhood and who has played a massive role in everything good the club has accomplished over the last decade.

[heimdall]

But we also can't lose sight of what a good player he is and how lucky we have been to keep him here for so long.  If he wanted to go abroad now I wouldn't hold it against him, because he has given us his best years and to be fair to him it doesn't look like we're any closer to winning the league.

Eventually he'll be regarded as our best player of all time.  He hasn't won the titles of some of the past greats, but he's kept this club going, at times single handedly for almost a decade.  It doesn't bear thinking about where we'd be now if we'd never had him, so let's keep a bit of perspective on the Gerrard issue.

Amen.  There's an awful lot of blinkered nonsense being chatted in this thread, IMO.  Gerrard isn't past it in a footballing sense and I don't buy into all the 'Stevie Me' stuff either.  I'm actually dismayed how easily some sections of the support are so ready to stick to the boot into a lad who has done everything for the club since childhood and who has played a massive role in everything good the club has accomplished over the last decade.

totally agree, the problems with Stevie and to a certain extent Nando is a lack of belief not a lack of ability and I completely understand Stevie being p1ssed off with the current situation. He can't be Mr Motivation all the time, everybody gets down in the dumps from time to time.

[Ben Patrick]

But we also can't lose sight of what a good player he is and how lucky we have been to keep him here for so long.  If he wanted to go abroad now I wouldn't hold it against him, because he has given us his best years and to be fair to him it doesn't look like we're any closer to winning the league.

Eventually he'll be regarded as our best player of all time.  He hasn't won the titles of some of the past greats, but he's kept this club going, at times single handedly for almost a decade.  It doesn't bear thinking about where we'd be now if we'd never had him, so let's keep a bit of perspective on the Gerrard issue.

Amen.  There's an awful lot of blinkered nonsense being chatted in this thread, IMO.  Gerrard isn't past it in a footballing sense and I don't buy into all the 'Stevie Me' stuff either.  I'm actually dismayed how easily some sections of the support are so ready to stick to the boot into a lad who has done everything for the club since childhood and who has played a massive role in everything good the club has accomplished over the last decade.

What he said

[Redman in wales]

But we also can't lose sight of what a good player he is and how lucky we have been to keep him here for so long.  If he wanted to go abroad now I wouldn't hold it against him, because he has given us his best years and to be fair to him it doesn't look like we're any closer to winning the league.

Eventually he'll be regarded as our best player of all time.  He hasn't won the titles of some of the past greats, but he's kept this club going, at times single handedly for almost a decade.  It doesn't bear thinking about where we'd be now if we'd never had him, so let's keep a bit of perspective on the Gerrard issue.

Amen.  There's an awful lot of blinkered nonsense being chatted in this thread, IMO.  Gerrard isn't past it in a footballing sense and I don't buy into all the 'Stevie Me' stuff either.  I'm actually dismayed how easily some sections of the support are so ready to stick to the boot into a lad who has done everything for the club since childhood and who has played a massive role in everything good the club has accomplished over the last decade.

What he said

exactly. i dont think many are sticking the boot in - i think its just one person  - perhaps two. The rest of us were just trying to  come up for a reason for his poor form

i dont think there's actually much diagreement in the thread.

we all (bar little hobo) think that he's not past it at all and just suffering  a long spell of poor form. we were just trying to explain it

[Owzat]

I haven't posted in this thread before (at least I don't believe I have) because it is one of those topics that you'd struggle to get more than slated for, whether right or wrong. I love the way Owen is written off but Gerrard is somehow untouchable, ironic given Owen has done pretty well given limited opportunity. Gerrard might never be the same player, although to some extent I feel his contribution is perceived as great based on a few "blood and thunder" performances and not so much week in, week out and recent performances.

I doubt very much he likes losing in a Liverpool shirt, I disagree with the picture painted that he somehow is carrying 10 poor players on his shoulder and dragged down, I think the side is not playing well but it's not like we're some Championship or struggling Premiership side. Like Rafa gets a lot of credit for Istanbul and the 2006 FA Cup 'win' (on penalties, we didn't win the games), I think Gerrard has hero status based on a few high profile games and some good club performances in the past.

Is he past it? Well it is a bold prediction that can only be tested by TIME not by derisory replies in a forum thread. I would very much be tempted to accept big offers, sometimes it isn't necessarily whether a player is past his best or struggling, but sometimes the time is just right to move on and his value will decline as he gets older. Age may catch up with him, his approach may just no longer be physically possible to sustain

[JC_81]

I haven't posted in this thread before (at least I don't believe I have) because it is one of those topics that you'd struggle to get more than slated for, whether right or wrong. I love the way Owen is written off but Gerrard is somehow untouchable, ironic given Owen has done pretty well given limited opportunity. Gerrard might never be the same player, although to some extent I feel his contribution is perceived as great based on a few "blood and thunder" performances and not so much week in, week out and recent performances.

I doubt very much he likes losing in a Liverpool shirt, I disagree with the picture painted that he somehow is carrying 10 poor players on his shoulder and dragged down, I think the side is not playing well but it's not like we're some Championship or struggling Premiership side. Like Rafa gets a lot of credit for Istanbul and the 2006 FA Cup 'win' (on penalties, we didn't win the games), I think Gerrard has hero status based on a few high profile games and some good club performances in the past.

Is he past it? Well it is a bold prediction that can only be tested by TIME not by derisory replies in a forum thread. I would very much be tempted to accept big offers, sometimes it isn't necessarily whether a player is past his best or struggling, but sometimes the time is just right to move on and his value will decline as he gets older. Age may catch up with him, his approach may just no longer be physically possible to sustain

I don't think throwing Owen into this debate is sensible mate.

He's been crocked for several seasons.  Granted he'll score goals when fit, but that just doesn't happen enough.

Let's not forget the one reason why these players should NEVER be compared.  When Benitez arrived at this club he pleaded with both to stay.  Gerrard stayed, fought for the cause despite Chelsea's approaches causing him to have a few wobbles, and Owen thought he could do better, ran his contract down and we lost a then 20+ million pound player for peanuts.

Owen had other priorities over LFC.  Hard to take, but it's true.  I never wanted him back here after the way he left.  The fact that he took a move to Newcastle instead of wearing Madrid down for half a season and coming here, says it all about the man.  In his head Michael is number one, England is number two and Liverpool FC was never more than number three.

Gerrard HAS carried this team for a long time and we should be grateful.  Only when he's injured or when he's out of form like he is now, do people actually appreciate it.

[stmichael]

Rafa gets a lot of credit for Istanbul and the 2006 FA Cup 'win' (on penalties, we didn't win the games), I think Gerrard has hero status based on a few high profile games and some good club performances in the past.

So you credit everything Benitez has achieved as our manager to Gerrard?

[LittleHobo]

Another reason for his demise i believe is hes lost a mental edge that was 100% important for him keeping putting in his rocky balboa save the day performances

that edge was his lifetime dream to win the title with liverpool, he believed it, he had faith and last year we came so close.......NOW HE DOES NOT BELIEVE, he knows we he will never win the title with us, the diffrence between us and man utd/chelsea is too great (with rafa or without him) it will take years to catch up

you can tell he doesnt believe anymore and now hes lost that belief he has lost that edge, when the mind goes the body follows......(godfather quote)

this is also one reason why he was always amazing for us but average for england...........motivation towards something is a powerfull thing

[Greavesie]

Another reason for his demise i believe is hes lost a mental edge that was 100% important for him keeping putting in his rocky balboa save the day performances

that edge was his lifetime dream to win the title with liverpool, he believed it, he had faith and last year we came so close.......NOW HE DOES NOT BELIEVE, he knows we he will never win the title with us, the diffrence between us and man utd/chelsea is too great (with rafa or without him) it will take years to catch up

you can tell he doesnt believe anymore and now hes lost that belief he has lost that edge, when the mind goes the body follows......(godfather quote)

this is also one reason why he was always amazing for us but average for england...........motivation towards something is a powerfull thing

I honestly believe it will take years to catch them and its only going to get harder with City's owners in the game now. I think the Mancs will struggle after Whiskey nose has gone but by then the gulf will be massive anyway

[LittleHobo]

Another reason for his demise i believe is hes lost a mental edge that was 100% important for him keeping putting in his rocky balboa save the day performances

that edge was his lifetime dream to win the title with liverpool, he believed it, he had faith and last year we came so close.......NOW HE DOES NOT BELIEVE, he knows we he will never win the title with us, the diffrence between us and man utd/chelsea is too great (with rafa or without him) it will take years to catch up

you can tell he doesnt believe anymore and now hes lost that belief he has lost that edge, when the mind goes the body follows......(godfather quote)

this is also one reason why he was always amazing for us but average for england...........motivation towards something is a powerfull thing

I honestly believe it will take years to catch them and its only going to get harder with City's owners in the game now. I think the Mancs will struggle after Whiskey nose has gone but by then the gulf will be massive anyway

true