Liverpool FC Forum

[supersub]

Madrid were sh.ite lets face it
Well done that we won
But lets not go overboard
Everton were harder to beat

cheesecakery

What flavour?

Toffee perhaps 


 

[heimdall]

Madrid were sh.ite lets face it
Well done that we won
But lets not go overboard
Everton were harder to beat

cheesecakery

What flavour?

Toffee perhaps 


 

As long as its not too bitter I hope.

[Sir Roger]

Madrid were sh.ite lets face it
Well done that we won
But lets not go overboard
Everton were harder to beat

cheesecakery

What flavour?

Toffee perhaps 


 

As long as its not too bitter I hope.

heimdall stop spamming at once you big tomboy!

Right GYBS?

[bigmick]

Just to revisit this for a sec', and specifically the feeling that there is over much optimism around as regards the league. I don't think we'll win it. I said that around December, and I still believe it so the admittedly excellent result in the Bernabau isn't going to change that.

BUT, (and that's as big a but as I know how to do) that does not mean we should just give it up. It does not mean either that we have absolutely zero point zero chance. There are twelve games to go, this Manc team WILL drop points during those twelve games. As it is they've won ever so many on the bounce, NOBODY in the Premiership wins 23 on the spin or whatever the feck it'll be. They will definately drop points.

I've already said, I think they'll win 8, draw 2 and lose 2 (as long as we beat them) in their remaining games. That would put them on 88 points, which is a decent total for a title winning Premiership team, which is about what they are, a decent probably Premiership winning team. They are nowhere near IMHO the best Man Utd teams of the past, the Mourinho Chelsea teams nor the Arsenal invincible team. They are a very good side though, who has allowed to play in a bubble under no pressure whatsoever for the last six weeks.

Now if you assume that I am right (it does happen occasionally honest) that would mean that 11 wins and a draw would get us home by 1 point. The unfortunate thing is, I'm far more confident about the Mancs dropping points than I am about us winning 11 and drawing 1 out of our last 12. Can we do it? Well it may be very difficult, but if we start slinging the likes of Dossena, Lucas, N'Gog and the rest into the mix it'll be an absolute impossibility. I think it would be absolute folly to put all our eggs in the Champions League basket, only to draw a good side in the next round and potentially go out.

I tell you this, if the Mancs do have a little wobble and finish on 85 points or something and because we didn't believe in ourselves enough we were too far back to take advantage, it'd be a footballing crime.

[account deleted by request]

Just to revisit this for a sec', and specifically the feeling that there is over much optimism around as regards the league. I don't think we'll win it. I said that around December, and I still believe it so the admittedly excellent result in the Bernabau isn't going to change that.

BUT, (and that's as big a but as I know how to do) that does not mean we should just give it up. It does not mean either that we have absolutely zero point zero chance. There are twelve games to go, this Manc team WILL drop points during those twelve games. As it is they've won ever so many on the bounce, NOBODY in the Premiership wins 23 on the spin or whatever the feck it'll be. They will definately drop points.

I've already said, I think they'll win 8, draw 2 and lose 2 (as long as we beat them) in their remaining games. That would put them on 88 points, which is a decent total for a title winning Premiership team, which is about what they are, a decent probably Premiership winning team. They are nowhere near IMHO the best Man Utd teams of the past, the Mourinho Chelsea teams nor the Arsenal invincible team. They are a very good side though, who has allowed to play in a bubble under no pressure whatsoever for the last six weeks.

Now if you assume that I am right (it does happen occasionally honest) that would mean that 11 wins and a draw would get us home by 1 point. The unfortunate thing is, I'm far more confident about the Mancs dropping points than I am about us winning 11 and drawing 1 out of our last 12. Can we do it? Well it may be very difficult, but if we start slinging the likes of Dossena, Lucas, N'Gog and the rest into the mix it'll be an absolute impossibility. I think it would be absolute folly to put all our eggs in the Champions League basket, only to draw a good side in the next round and potentially go out.

I tell you this, if the Mancs do have a little wobble and finish on 85 points or something and because we didn't believe in ourselves enough we were too far back to take advantage, it'd be a footballing crime.

Have you been using my scientific calculator Mick? I posted a while back that the mancs would get about 88 points and we would get 82 points 

[bigmick]

Yep. I'll stick it in the post back to you mate. If I post it today it'll be there this time next year

[Effes]

So we havent got defensive brilliance or class then ?

Apologies - I should have made myself clearer.

We have defensive brilliance. We're tight as a drum and I'm impressed with the work rate the team as a whole puts in when we don't have the ball.

When we're on the ball, we lack class, smarts and creativity. We lack invention. We lack thinking outside the box when it's not working.

and to my original question - how many times play the wonderful creative football you crave from liverpool and also win trophies ?

I don't understand the question.

Some care about lovely football. Some care about results.

What everyone is forgetting is that both are possible.

This was your quote in your post and the question relates to that .

In an attacking sense you do realise that the mancs have only scored 3 more goals than us this season.

Again, you're looking at the end result. Goals, trophies. I don't blame you either. You're frustrated and angry we haven't won the league in 19 years while the scum clean up.
I'm asking you to look at the big picture and not be so
shortsighted.

Yes, I'm aware that the Mancs have scored only 3 more goals than us - but look at the manner in which they did it. They play like they love it and they're managed by a man who loves to be entertained by his team. Can you say the same about us?

That said, maybe I'm wrong and a team based on graft instead of skill is the way forward.

Avi, I get what you are saying. And in a way, that's what every team should be aiming for.

But maybe it should be a case of "learning to walk before we can run"?

Anyway, back to Mick's topic.

I would love our Champs League form to rub off on our League form. But the history of LFC under Rafa points in the other direction - we normally do worse in the League when we have a good run in the Champs League.

So No Mick, I cant see it.

[account deleted by request]

In truth mate I really gave up hope of the league against Wigan. Last season I also gave up hope of the title after the Wigan match so we have progressed slightly (by about 20 days). I think if we were hot on the mancs heels we could maybe hope for them slipping up, but with them so far in front a draw is no longer a disaster for them, while for us anything but a win is a total disaster. The pressure is off them and they can relax knowing a draw against us and the title is theirs.

I think you are right in that we may well string a few wins together, but not enough to matter unless the mancs really screw up.

All my hopes now lie in the CL, I would settle for second now in the league, because I think there is more chance of us being caught than doing any catching.

[NANNY RED]

Im stiil hoping against hope. you gotta have it havnt you, Hope that it

[account deleted by request]

Im stiil hoping against hope. you gotta have it havnt you, Hope that it

I would put all your hope (and a few quid ) on the CL Nanny.

[Sabre]

The game against Madrid helps the confindence but means little to kickstart a title. The game at Old Trafford will be the key one.

If you are one point down, and you lose there, you are 4 points down but morally destroyed.

If you are seven points down, and you win there, you are 4 points down, but them will have many doubts.

So the real kickstart will be that game and if any, that will be the day I'll give up.

[Effes]

The game against Madrid helps the confindence but means little to kickstart a title. The game at Old Trafford will be the key one.

If you are one point down, and you lose there, you are 4 points down but morally destroyed.

If you are seven points down, and you win there, you are 4 points down, but them will have many doubts.

So the real kickstart will be that game and if any, that will be the day I'll give up.

But Sabre, if we draw at Boro we are 6 behind and they have a game in hand.
Win our 2 league games before Man U, and THEN it's a Cup Final.

By the way, what have the Spanish press been saying about our win?

[ConnO'var]

*
*
*
Anyway, back to Mick's topic.

I would love our Champs League form to rub off on our League form. But the history of LFC under Rafa points in the other direction - we normally do worse in the League when we have a good run in the Champs League.

So No Mick, I cant see it.

I agree, Effes.... my gut tells me the exact, same thing.

And to be honest, I am not happy about it. Hand on heart, I'd rather we get knocked out of the Champions League right now if it means that we are then able to give the League a proper go.... It has been years since we've been this close and if we bottle it at the end due to the teams lack of experience in chasing the title, I can accept that..... At least we've tried..... If we take liberties in the run-in due to worrying about commitments/resources to the remaining competitions, then in addition to being disappointed, I shall feel seriously annoyed.

The Mancs are closing in our record of titles.... We ARE the best club in England...... I cannot stomach it if we lose that proud record and allow Ferguson the satisfaction of retiring, knowing that he has indeed "knocked us off our !@#$%^! perch" and have history back up that statement with facts.

I won't deny that the man's a wonderful manager for his team.... but I still hate him with a passion..... Almost as much as the bitters...

[Sabre]

I planned to do a translation of the headlines for tomorrow.

I don't have the time now, gotta sleep, but in a nutshell:

* The Madrid press sings praises of Liverpool and Rafa Benitez
* The Marca "opinion" journos say Madrid misses a Xabi Alonso
* The Madrid opinion journos start saying Rafa must be the next Madrid coach.
* I don't know if you hear the chairman Boluda said that they'd win 3-1 there and 1-2 here. The Madrid headlines basically mock of that prediction and are very harsh of him. They talk about humble pies.


The Barcelona press is pure mockery as you can imagine.

It's remarkable that even if they're biased, none of them think Liverpool victory was unfair. They don't complain about the ref, they think that Heinze's foul was a silly one, but it was foul (so do I). They said you cannot make that silly mistakes at this level.

About the second leg, they're Real Madrid. So they don't give up, they think they have a good chance of winning at Anfield, it's their mentality and it's normal they think that.

We'd do well being humble and working hard (unlike them), as arrogance is paid dearly at this level.

So respect, admittance of Liverpool's superiority, praises for our players (especially Carraguer, Alonso and Mascherano), and hurted feelings. They admit openly that victory hurted. They talk about how history gave a new stab in their hearts at Min 81 again, the same minute in which Kennedy scored in 1981. Curious.

[Effes]

Cheers Sabre