Liverpool FC Forum

[JoeTerp]

I planned to do a translation of the headlines for tomorrow.

I don't have the time now, gotta sleep, but in a nutshell:

* The Madrid press sings praises of Liverpool and Rafa Benitez
* The Marca "opinion" journos say Madrid misses a Xabi Alonso
* The Madrid opinion journos start saying Rafa must be the next Madrid coach.
* I don't know if you hear the chairman Boluda said that they'd win 3-1 there and 1-2 here. The Madrid headlines basically mock of that prediction and are very harsh of him. They talk about humble pies.


The Barcelona press is pure mockery as you can imagine.

It's remarkable that even if they're biased, none of them think Liverpool victory was unfair. They don't complain about the ref, they think that Heinze's foul was a silly one, but it was foul (so do I). They said you cannot make that silly mistakes at this level.

About the second leg, they're Real Madrid. So they don't give up, they think they have a good chance of winning at Anfield, it's their mentality and it's normal they think that.

We'd do well being humble and working hard (unlike them), as arrogance is paid dearly at this level.

So respect, admittance of Liverpool's superiority, praises for our players (especially Carraguer, Alonso and Mascherano), and hurted feelings. They admit openly that victory hurted. They talk about how history gave a new stab in their hearts at Min 81 again, the same minute in which Kennedy scored in 1981. Curious.

also seemed to be mentions of a perfect pairing in central midfield with Xabi and Macherano.  and pointed out how Liverpool started more Spanish players than Madrid (comments below the article seemed to defend the team by pointing out that Madrid have more Spanish players than Liverpool have English players)


Dutch players are to Real Madrid what Spanish players are to Liverpool. Good thing for us, Spain is better than Holland in footie (although I wouldn't mind having Sneijder)

[kan]

People who only know of Liverpool tend to ask me questions like why Liverpool only does well in Champions League and underachieves in the Premier League.
Is this assumption true (statistically it seems so) and why?

[bigmick]

People who only know of Liverpool tend to ask me questions like why Liverpool only does well in Champions League and underachieves in the Premier League.
Is this assumption true (statistically it seems so) and why?

Yes it's true mate. As to why, there are lots of reasons and if you read the last four years worth of posts you probably still would be hard pressed to nail it down.

If on the other hand you can't be bothered, I'll save you a job. It's all because of rotation  .

[account deleted by request]

People who only know of Liverpool tend to ask me questions like why Liverpool only does well in Champions League and underachieves in the Premier League.
Is this assumption true (statistically it seems so) and why?

Could be any number of reasons, rotation, squad not strong enough, foreign players don't like the cold , players raise their games for Europe but can't week in week out . If we knew the real answer to your question we might do better !

I think it may have something to do with the the old saying the best defences win cups, the best teams win leagues.

[bigmick]

I think it may have something to do with the the old saying the best defences win cups, the best teams win leagues.

Never heard that before S@int, quite a good one though.

[kan]

Could be any number of reasons, rotation, squad not strong enough, foreign players don't like the cold , players raise their games for Europe but can't week in week out . If we knew the real answer to your question we might do better !

I think it may have something to do with the the old saying the best defences win cups, the best teams win leagues.

well, it's not just LIverpool who's facing this phenomena. Inter, Real and Lyon who do fantastic in domestic leagues always stumble in the international stages.
By the way, I saw the movie Green Street Hooligans a couple months back, and was wondering if the movie over exaggerates hooliganism in Europe or is it really like that? I know that hooliganism does lead to arrests and maybe deaths, but do rival fans fight before and after every game?

[kan]

I think it may have something to do with the the old saying the best defences win cups, the best teams win leagues.

Never heard that before S@int, quite a good one though.

i would have thought it was the opposite.
the defensively strongest team wins the league but the best team overall wins the Cup. (like Liverpool!)

[oakton]

if we can avoid all of the premier league teams, then yes we'll have a chance

[bigmick]

By the way, I saw the movie Green Street Hooligans a couple months back, and was wondering if the movie over exaggerates hooliganism in Europe or is it really like that? I know that hooliganism does lead to arrests and maybe deaths, but do rival fans fight before and after every game?

Rival fans mate, what about fans of the same team? Stick around here for a bit and you'll see that that film you're on about is feck all compared to real life    .

[account deleted by request]

I think it may have something to do with the the old saying the best defences win cups, the best teams win leagues.

Never heard that before S@int, quite a good one though.

i would have thought it was the opposite.
the defensively strongest team wins the league but the best team overall wins the Cup. (like Liverpool!)

I think the theory is one mistake in the cup and you can be out, in the league you can lose a game or two but still win it.

No mate, in the early 70's there was a bit of trouble but not much now. (Maybe at Millwall )

[ConnO'var]

People who only know of Liverpool tend to ask me questions like why Liverpool only does well in Champions League and underachieves in the Premier League.
Is this assumption true (statistically it seems so) and why?

Yes it's true mate. As to why, there are lots of reasons and if you read the last four years worth of posts you probably still would be hard pressed to nail it down.

If on the other hand you can't be bothered, I'll save you a job. It's all because of rotation  .

   

[Owzat]

Nice own goal bigmick, what it did to our league campaign starts with a 'K' but 'kickstart' it, it didn't. I rather think Rafa had already decided he was much more likely to win the Champions League, maybe wants to more, and maybe it showed in some dodgy choices yesterday - use of Skrtel, absence of Benayoun who's been scoring recently, picking Babel, playing Kuyt up front, starting with El Zhar for the first time ever and not making a substitution until 2/3 of the way through the game when 0-1 down for 1/3 of it previous.

If he had been serious about winning the league then maybe he wouldn't have picked Torres and Gerrard midweek and both could have started yesterday, we lost Gerrard through Rafa's cluelessness and ineptitude in the FA Cup requiring 210 mins to LOSE to the bitters and costing us not only humiliation, but players through injury and suspension. Youth team in the FA Cup, Youth team in the Carling Cup and a mix of second string for the league. We're no way strong enough to win at the Bernie Inn and then away in the Premiership three days later.

This could be our Reading of last season, losing to Boro on aggregate is disgraceful given their league form.

[Salty Sock]

Nice own goal bigmick, what it did to our league campaign starts with a 'K' but 'kickstart' it, it didn't. I rather think Rafa had already decided he was much more likely to win the Champions League, maybe wants to more, and maybe it showed in some dodgy choices yesterday - use of Skrtel, absence of Benayoun who's been scoring recently, picking Babel, playing Kuyt up front, starting with El Zhar for the first time ever and not making a substitution until 2/3 of the way through the game when 0-1 down for 1/3 of it previous.

If he had been serious about winning the league then maybe he wouldn't have picked Torres and Gerrard midweek and both could have started yesterday, we lost Gerrard through Rafa's cluelessness and ineptitude in the FA Cup requiring 210 mins to LOSE to the bitters and costing us not only humiliation, but players through injury and suspension. Youth team in the FA Cup, Youth team in the Carling Cup and a mix of second string for the league. We're no way strong enough to win at the Bernie Inn and then away in the Premiership three days later.

This could be our Reading of last season, losing to Boro on aggregate is disgraceful given their league form.

I can't help but feel a heavy scent of rafa-hate eminating from your glands
You have great input though I think Rafa has decided against the Champions league as a primary focus..

[Owzat]

Nice own goal bigmick, what it did to our league campaign starts with a 'K' but 'kickstart' it, it didn't. I rather think Rafa had already decided he was much more likely to win the Champions League, maybe wants to more, and maybe it showed in some dodgy choices yesterday - use of Skrtel, absence of Benayoun who's been scoring recently, picking Babel, playing Kuyt up front, starting with El Zhar for the first time ever and not making a substitution until 2/3 of the way through the game when 0-1 down for 1/3 of it previous.

If he had been serious about winning the league then maybe he wouldn't have picked Torres and Gerrard midweek and both could have started yesterday, we lost Gerrard through Rafa's cluelessness and ineptitude in the FA Cup requiring 210 mins to LOSE to the bitters and costing us not only humiliation, but players through injury and suspension. Youth team in the FA Cup, Youth team in the Carling Cup and a mix of second string for the league. We're no way strong enough to win at the Bernie Inn and then away in the Premiership three days later.

This could be our Reading of last season, losing to Boro on aggregate is disgraceful given their league form.

I can't help but feel a heavy scent of rafa-hate eminating from your glands
You have great input though I think Rafa has decided against the Champions league as a primary focus..

I don't 'hate' Rafa, I do hate that people feel they have to label people 'anti-Rafa' or 'Rafa haters' though.

We're going nowhere under him, a vicious cycle. Time for change as he hasn't mounted a serious title challenge and we're just back to focusing on the Champions League as a consolation prize. Ironic really that the mancs find winning the Premiership so easy and want(ed) the Champions League so badly, we supposedly want the Premiership so bad and find the Champions League relatively easy.

While it's hard to prove Rafa is prioritising the Champions League, in fact it may not matter because if he isn't then he's just incapable of winning the Premiership, there is evidence in the relative performances and selections. Would Rafa have put out a side like he did against Boro against Real? Last season Crouch's last two games were 90 mins against Fulham and Brum - both preceding the semi-finals of the Champions League in which he played no part.

Of course the crunch may come as to whether Rafa feels safe in our league position or goes all out for a Champions League challenge. I think he's already shown he can't mount a serious and longlasting title challenge, and had five seasons to do it. How many more seasons can we go without winning the Premiership while the mancs equal and pass our 18?

[bigmick]

Nice own goal bigmick, what it did to our league campaign starts with a 'K' but 'kickstart' it, it didn't.

Yeah sorry about that everyone. Me starting the thread was the reason we lost.

On a serious note, I still think that we will end up looking back and thinking "if only we could have won eleven out of our last twelve, we'd have won it. We could still do that, but we won't.

We can almost offically declare that we won't win the Premiership this season. Obviously nest season we are going to need to imporve on games where we've dropped points, and maintain our level in games which we've done well.

So far this season, we've beaten Chelsea Home and Away, we've beaten the Mancs at Home, and we drew at the Emirates. I wonder how many people think we'll match that next season.