Liverpool FC Forum

[johnbarnes]

Heard both Sturridge and Benteke want out. Obviously Benteke can probably go but Sturridge would be bit of a blow but there is an argument he is on his way down when it comes to injuries so maybe selling him for a good price and bringing in a quality striker may make sense

Their views reflect that of Klopp so no problem. Cash in, save the wages and replace them with injury free players who can score. Job done. There's no time to be sentimental.

In 3 years time no one will be able to name the current team, they're all Billy-no-marks.

We stood and watched The King 'Billy-no-marks' play...
And he couldn't play! 

[C-R]

The Guardian are reporting this morning that Watford are interested in both Joe Allen and Jordan Ibe, sonder what kind of money would be on the table for that pair

[johnbarnes]

I think versatility has ruined this game mate ,I remember when we had  players that were the very best in their positions and that was all they needed to be . Now we have players who can get moved all over the pitch rather than taking the position they excel at to a different level. Milner was a workhorse for City and to an extent he's brought that to us ,but in terms of invention and bringing a fluidity to our midfield he offers little ,he brings industry rather than mastery or artistry ,and this is why I think we should distance ourselves from such players. What we need is a proficiency in one position ,a chance for the players to grow and develop in a place on the pitch that seems almost designed to show their ability .

100% spot on!
Barca has sold this versatile way of football for the past 8-10 years. But it is there way of playing under their own system and it works for them until a time their team gets old. Just like other clubs throughout the generations.
Just because it works for one club doesn't mean it can be translated into another - this was the miserable disaster of the previous management.
--
WE NEED specialists in particular areas of the pitch -
E.G. A goalkeeper that can catch, save and throw - not a goalie that enjoys playing tiki-taka in his won 18 yard box and putting his defence under needless pressure.
Proficiency is a great word to use BEERGOGGLES  - As this is what we need and we can only hope that a native of arguably the most proficient nation in the world can share his understanding of this by building a team that can dominate domestically and in Europe 

hmmm abit strange reading this... you know that Germany has a national team that didn't play with an out-and-out striker and won the world cup right? And from the way we're being linked with Gotze, we seem to be heading to that kind of versatility direction...

Not strange at all. Players should be brought in primarily to do a specific job. Of course there are times when the manager will ask them to play out of their 'natural' position, due to injuries or tactics. Am sure Germany played with Klose upfront and also used Shirley who is an attacking midfielder?
Anyway - Round pegs in round holes - That's all I'm saying.
Would you agree or do you think the manager should go for 11 versatile players?

[maguskwt]

Not talking about 11 versatile players... but gone are the days where you play with a wing specialist, CM specialist, an out-and-out striker, an out-and-out full back, a centre back who just stay at the back etc. It's not a specific job like you put it anymore... that's just an out-dated mind set...

[johnbarnes]

Not talking about 11 versatile players... but gone are the days where you play with a wing specialist, CM specialist, an out-and-out striker, an out-and-out full back, a centre back who just stay at the back etc. It's not a specific job like you put it anymore... that's just an out-dated mind set...

Wing specialist - what is R. Sterling a part from a 50m flop?
Can - used as a defender (looked average) when it was quite clear he is a Midfielder - now looks like a proper Midfielder...
---
Carra, Hamman, Finnan, Alonso, Hyypia, Baros the list goes on.
Juventus got to the CL Final last season. I didn't see much versatility in their team.
What am I missing?
Please enlighten me...
---
It's a myth to think that because a player(s) runs 'out of position' that they are showing their versatility. This has ALWAYS happened in football - It's the natural order of things.
I should know - When I saw fit, I would play as a supporting striker, not just a winger. And when the team needed me I would defend like a trooper. Man; I even adopted my game as I got older to play a more central role in Midfield... I was the false no.9 before Murdoch formed Sky plc. But everyone will remember me for being a lightning quick winger, proudly wearing the Liver Bird on my chest! 

[maguskwt]

Not talking about 11 versatile players... but gone are the days where you play with a wing specialist, CM specialist, an out-and-out striker, an out-and-out full back, a centre back who just stay at the back etc. It's not a specific job like you put it anymore... that's just an out-dated mind set...

Wing specialist - what is R. Sterling a part from a 50m flop?
Can - used as a defender (looked average) when it was quite clear he is a Midfielder - now looks like a proper Midfielder...
---
Carra, Hamman, Finnan, Alonso, Hyypia, Baros the list goes on.
Juventus got to the CL Final last season. I didn't see much versatility in their team.
What am I missing?
Please enlighten me...
---
It's a myth to think that because a player(s) runs 'out of position' that they are showing their versatility. This has ALWAYS happened in football - It's the natural order of things.
I should know - When I saw fit, I would play as a supporting striker, not just a winger. And when the team needed me I would defend like a trooper. Man; I even adopted my game as I got older to play a more central role in Midfield... I was the false no.9 before Murdoch formed Sky plc. But everyone will remember me for being a lightning quick winger, proudly wearing the Liver Bird on my chest! 

How do you define Ronaldo, Messi, Suarez, Neymar? At most you can say is that they're forwards. How do you define Gerrard? With how many AM's or forwards did Germany play with? There are more and more versatile players in successful teams. I'm not saying there is no need for specialist players. But the modern game has moved on from deploying 9-10 specialist players in a 4-4-2 formation. Nowadays it'd more like 5-6 versatile players  and 4-5 specialist players...

[RED BEERGOGGLES]

I think my original argument that spawned this debate about 'versatility' has somehow become skewered ,what I intended to put across was that players are no longer afforded the time or indeed the patience to play the position they were intended for. I mean take Markovic a natural pacey winger suddenly buffeted to WB ,whilst we endured the countless half arsed performances of a player who clearly didn't want to be here anymore !

I understand the players must evolve with the progression of the game ,its just when a player is brought to this club for a specific position in mind and then asked to play in a variety of other positions it removes the possibility of him becoming the best in the role he was originally procured for.

[maguskwt]

I think my original argument that spawned this debate about 'versatility' has somehow become skewered ,what I intended to put across was that players are no longer afforded the time or indeed the patience to play the position they were intended for. I mean take Markovic a natural pacey winger suddenly buffeted to WB ,whilst we endured the countless half arsed performances of a player who clearly didn't want to be here anymore !

I understand the players must evolve with the progression of the game ,its just when a player is brought to this club for a specific position in mind and then asked to play in a variety of other positions it removes the possibility of him becoming the best in the role he was originally procured for.

That's true...I think if a players thinks he's an attacker asked to do a predominantly defense role then that is something of a mismatch.

[Thommo's perm]

Moreno
Skrtel
Allen
Sturridge
Lucas
Milner
Benteke

[C-R]

Moreno
Skrtel
Allen
Sturridge
Lucas
Milner
Benteke

would add to this list...

Henderson (reported interest from Spurs)
Balotelli (reported interest from China & Turkey)
Alberto
Bogdan
Kolo (contract up anyway)
Enrique (contract up anyway)
Sinclair (off to Watford anyway)
Ilori
Teixeira
Ibe (interest from Watford)
Yesil
Wisdom


The amount of players I have listed is highly unrealistic to move on in one window (i know this), but they are the players I deem surplus

[Thommo's perm]

I would keep Kolo because I like him and Ibe because he could improve wit the right attitude
The rest...

[Penguins]

I wouldn't really bat an eyelid no matter who we would sell, bar Coutinho.

Can, Lovren and Origi should stay.
Milner and Henderson are ok but are on insane wages and not worth it.
Lallana is a decent squad player and not a priority.

All goalkeepers are Sh*t bar Migs. He is going nowhere signing a new contract just a few months ago.
All the defender are way below acceptable bar Clyne who is very average and Lovren. The rest are just too poor making stupid mistakes.
Don't care for any forward bar Origi the way they are playing.

So besides around 5 players the rest a average to Sh*t.

[Reg]

The idea is to get rid of the low hanging fruit first so lets shelf the non first teamers straight away:

Benteke
Balotelli
Alberto
Kolo
Enrique
Sinclair
Ilori
Teixeira
Ibe
Yesil

Ok, not knowing who Klopp will bring in, I'd say the next level of dispensible players are:

Bogdan
Moreno
Skrtel
Allen
Sturridge
Hendo

Which leaves Lucas and Milner adding consistency during a rebuild for another day.

The fact is we need to bin 3 major strikers (Balo, Ben10 and Sturridge and to a lesser extend Ibe etc..) without knowing if we're going to get proper replacements and how quickly they'll bed in.

Happy to keep Migs, Clyne, Lovren, Sakho, LB? Can, Hendo, Lucas, maybe Milner as the core of the team however in reality is we have a 35 man squad, bearly 10 of them deserve to stay.

Rodgers really did waste money though.......

[Thommo's perm]

Would agree with Reg about these:
Benteke
Balotelli
Alberto
Kolo
Enrique
Sinclair
Ilori
Teixeira
Ibe
Yesil

also:
Bogdan
Moreno
Skrtel
Allen
Sturridge
Hendo

I would probably add on Lucas and have a good look at the young players who were picked yesterday as they were all dogsh'it
There has to be a complete overhaul if we are to challenge next season. Im sure the manager is already ahead of the game

[Eagle]

Ok so this thread has just become silly with people coming in after every defeat and pretty much listing all of the squad which obviously isn’t realistic. Take a look at the below. What you need to do is whittle our existing squad down to 20 and then add 5 players who we could realistically get this summer, giving us a squad of 25 players for the season. Assume we will play 4-2-3-1 as our main formation next season. Everyone else will either be sold or sent out on a season long loan meaning they won’t be available at all.

1 - Marc-André ter Stegen
2 - Mignolet
3 - Ward
Bogdan
4 - Lovren
5 - Sakho
6 - Matip
7 - Toure
Skrtel
8 - Gomez
Ilori
Wisdom
9 - Clyne
10 - Flanagan
11 - Jonas Hector
12 - Moreno
Smith
Enrique
13 - Can
14 - Mahmoud Dahoud
Henderson
15 - Grujić
Lucus
16 - Allen
Stewart
17 - Milner
18 - Ousmane Dembélé
Ibe
19 - Ojo
20 - Lallana
Teixeira
Alberto
Markovic
21 - Coutinho
22 - Firmino
Sturridge
23 - Origi
24 - Lucas Alario
25 - Ings
Benteke
Balotelli