Chris Bascombe Leaves the Liverpool Echo... - ...for NOTW

Liverpool Football Club - General Discussion

Postby supersub » Tue Sep 04, 2007 9:22 am

woof woof ! wrote:I fully understand our antipathy towards the Sun but before I comment on Bascombes "defection" would/could somebody please tell me how many of the Suns current personnel were employed by the Sun at the time that they made their disgraceful accusations about LFC fans .

I'm not looking to excuse them (far from it) , but not being a Sun reader I don't know who writes or edits the paper and now find myself wondering are the people we vent our spleen on actually the one's who deserve it ? .

Born just after WW2 I grew up hating all Germans , it wasn't until 20 years after WW2 that I realised all Germans weren't in fact Nazis.

Like I said , I'm not looking to defend them ,it's just that before I comment on Bascombes decision I'd like to know how many of the journalists who wrote such sh'ite about us and the editors who allowed it to be published are still actually working for the Sun .

It's the same view I share.....

As well as boycotting the Scum paper it would be fitting to give a few other companies the cold shoulder;
The real perpetrator of the lies was Kelvin McKenzie,who has well gone.Boycott Talksport radio,because I believe he is a shareholder in the company.He also has his fingers in Sky TV...

As for the journalistic cohorts from the Scum,I don't know

Bascombe's move to the NOTW,still won't make me buy that sleazy rag either
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Postby Leonmc0708 » Tue Sep 04, 2007 9:42 am

supersub wrote:
woof woof ! wrote:I fully understand our antipathy towards the Sun but before I comment on Bascombes "defection" would/could somebody please tell me how many of the Suns current personnel were employed by the Sun at the time that they made their disgraceful accusations about LFC fans .

I'm not looking to excuse them (far from it) , but not being a Sun reader I don't know who writes or edits the paper and now find myself wondering are the people we vent our spleen on actually the one's who deserve it ? .

Born just after WW2 I grew up hating all Germans , it wasn't until 20 years after WW2 that I realised all Germans weren't in fact Nazis.

Like I said , I'm not looking to defend them ,it's just that before I comment on Bascombes decision I'd like to know how many of the journalists who wrote such sh'ite about us and the editors who allowed it to be published are still actually working for the Sun .

It's the same view I share.....

As well as boycotting the Scum paper it would be fitting to give a few other companies the cold shoulder;
The real perpetrator of the lies was Kelvin McKenzie,who has well gone.Boycott Talksport radio,because I believe he is a shareholder in the company.He also has his fingers in Sky TV...

As for the journalistic cohorts from the Scum,I don't know

Bascombe's move to the NOTW,still won't make me buy that sleazy rag either

MacKenzie writes for the Sun and NOTW
JUSTICE FOR THE 96

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Postby woof woof ! » Tue Sep 04, 2007 10:06 am

Leonmc0708 wrote:
supersub wrote:
woof woof ! wrote:I fully understand our antipathy towards the Sun but before I comment on Bascombes "defection" would/could somebody please tell me how many of the Suns current personnel were employed by the Sun at the time that they made their disgraceful accusations about LFC fans .

I'm not looking to excuse them (far from it) , but not being a Sun reader I don't know who writes or edits the paper and now find myself wondering are the people we vent our spleen on actually the one's who deserve it ? .

Born just after WW2 I grew up hating all Germans , it wasn't until 20 years after WW2 that I realised all Germans weren't in fact Nazis.

Like I said , I'm not looking to defend them ,it's just that before I comment on Bascombes decision I'd like to know how many of the journalists who wrote such sh'ite about us and the editors who allowed it to be published are still actually working for the Sun .

It's the same view I share.....

As well as boycotting the Scum paper it would be fitting to give a few other companies the cold shoulder;
The real perpetrator of the lies was Kelvin McKenzie,who has well gone.Boycott Talksport radio,because I believe he is a shareholder in the company.He also has his fingers in Sky TV...

As for the journalistic cohorts from the Scum,I don't know

Bascombe's move to the NOTW,still won't make me buy that sleazy rag either

MacKenzie writes for the Sun and NOTW

In which case Bascombe certainly does not get my support.
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Postby Redbilly1960 » Tue Sep 04, 2007 10:29 am

I know some one has already posted simalar but I thought I would expand on it.
the s*n when it published the :censored: about Hillsborough was owned by and still is owned by Rupert Murdoch a ruthless and successful businessman who I would guess his sole purpose in life is to make money. I don't believe for one minute he had anything to do with what was written in the s*n. There is only one person the Fans of Liverpool Football Club and the People of Merseyside should hold responsible and that is Mckenzie which ever stone he crawls under we should be putting bigger ones on top so the ba5tard cant crawl out.
the s*n rightly is unavailable on Merseyside and we should keep it like that. The NOTW maybe the sister paper to the s*n but so is The Times and all the things listed below are relatives of the s*n do we boycott them all. No more Sky sports no more Simpsons no more posting goal clips on Myspace lets keep it to the s*n but also lets keep boycotting mckenzie. If Bascombe had gone to the s*n different story but let the guy earn a living and I say good luck to him.
The s*n will never apologies and I can see why. We live in a blame culture, if the s*n says sorry it is admiting it did something wrong and the the sleazy greazy lawyers will be all over Liverpool looking for victims and there will be no shortage of people claiming distress and hurt for what was written. It would cost Murdoch millions in damages. So any chance we have of the s*n ever saying sorry is small.

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Postby thegreedo » Tue Sep 04, 2007 10:37 am

Can't be doing with anything Mackenzie is involved with. Have to say I will be very disappointed if Bascome does indeed make the decision to join the rag but a man must stand by the decisions he makes and he will have to live with the moral ramifications.
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Postby ConnO'var » Tue Sep 04, 2007 10:49 am

Leonmc0708 wrote:The Sun and NOTW run offers where you have to buy the papers for tokens, as well as bingo and the like.

Anyone who disassociates one from the other is either stupid or lying.

As for people saying fair enough, the principle of doubling your wage is all well and good, but when you have been as close to both the people and club as Bascombe has, you must understand people will be pis.sed.

For those that have fogotten what happened, they printed stories depicting Liverpool fans stealing from dying members of their families and friends, urinating on dead bodies of loved ones as well as pointing the finger of blame at "drunken yob fans without tickets".

Court cases proved the blame was not the fans but the police.

Imagine losing someone at a football match. Imagine now reading stories about how you stole from them as they lay dying.. Imagine people printing stories about how you where responsible for their death.

Now tell me the boycott should not extend to the Sunday version of a paper that printed that bullsh.it.

Agree 100%.

I actually liked his articles. Won't be reading any from now on though.

Can't believe that he'll be working in the SAME office and the SAME organization as that kunt McKenzie.

I understand his reasons though.... but don't agree with this choice of his.

Shame....
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Postby stmichael » Tue Sep 04, 2007 1:45 pm

I'm not a scouser myself but I was speaking to a Scouse mate of mine yesterday on this issue. He was saying that the one thing that’s always pi$$ed him off about the city is the holier-than-thou ‘honest working class folk hero’ sh#t that gets shoved down your throat, and the tendency toward cheap and empty soundbite sentimentality. In other words, anger and grief often being displayed purely and simply for public consumption.

I think a lot of people out there reckon that shouting ‘Justice for the 96!’ when they’re surrounded by a crowd of people makes them a better scouser or a better red. As far as I'm concerned, keep to your principles by all means, and if someone is reading the S*n tell them the score, but a man’s life and career is nobody’s business but his own.
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Postby adamnbarrett » Tue Sep 04, 2007 2:30 pm

Redbilly1960 wrote:I know some one has already posted simalar but I thought I would expand on it.
the s*n when it published the :censored: about Hillsborough was owned by and still is owned by Rupert Murdoch a ruthless and successful businessman who I would guess his sole purpose in life is to make money. I don't believe for one minute he had anything to do with what was written in the s*n. There is only one person the Fans of Liverpool Football Club and the People of Merseyside should hold responsible and that is Mckenzie which ever stone he crawls under we should be putting bigger ones on top so the ba5tard cant crawl out.
the s*n rightly is unavailable on Merseyside and we should keep it like that. The NOTW maybe the sister paper to the s*n but so is The Times and all the things listed below are relatives of the s*n do we boycott them all. No more Sky sports no more Simpsons no more posting goal clips on Myspace lets keep it to the s*n but also lets keep boycotting mckenzie. If Bascombe had gone to the s*n different story but let the guy earn a living and I say good luck to him.
The s*n will never apologies and I can see why. We live in a blame culture, if the s*n says sorry it is admiting it did something wrong and the the sleazy greazy lawyers will be all over Liverpool looking for victims and there will be no shortage of people claiming distress and hurt for what was written. It would cost Murdoch millions in damages. So any chance we have of the s*n ever saying sorry is small.

The relative of the s*n
Film
• Twentieth Century Fox
• Twentieth Century Fox Español
• Twentieth Century Fox International
• Twentieth Century Fox Television
• Fox Searchlight Pictures
• Fox Studios Australia
• Fox Studios Baja
• Fox Studios Los Angeles
• Fox Television Studios
Television
• bTV
• BSkyB
• The DirecTV Group
• Fox Broadcasting Company
• Fox Sports Australia
• Fox Television Stations
• Foxtel
• Star Group Limited
• Sky Latin America
• Sky Television Italy
• Latvijas Neatkar & Telev
• TV5 
Cable
• Fox Movie Channel
• Fox News Channel
• Fox Soccer Channel
• Fox Sports Channel
• Fox Sports Enterprises
• Fox Sports en Español
• Fox Sports Net
• FUEL TV
• FX Networks
• Fox Reality
• National Geographic Channel
• SPEED Channel
• Turner South
• LAPTV (Latin America - co-owned with Paramount Pictures/Viacom, Metro-Goldwyn-Mayer/MGM Holdings and Universal Studios/NBC Universal)
• Telecine (Brazil - co-owned with Globosat Canais, Paramount Pictures, Metro-Goldwyn-Mayer, Universal Studios and DreamWorks/Viacom);
Magazines and Inserts
• InsideOut
• donna hay
• News America Marketing
• SmartSource
• The Weekly Standard
• Gemstar
Newspapers
• News International
United Kingdom
The Sun
News of the World
The Times
Sunday Times
• News Corporation Ltd.
Australia
The Daily Telegraph (Sydney)
The Australian (national)
The Advertiser and Sunday Mail (Adelaide)
The Sunday Times (Perth)
Herald Sun (Melbourne)
mX (Melbourne, Sydney and Brisbane)
The Courier-Mail (Brisbane)
Geelong Advertiser
Gold Coast Bulletin
The Mercury and Sunday Tasmanian (Hobart)
New Zealand
Sunday State-Times
United States
New York Post
The Wall Street Journal
Books
• HarperCollins
Miscellaneous
• National Rugby League (NRL) (50%)
• MySpace
• Photobucket
• Sibelius Software

The NOTW is not a sister paper of the s*n.

It is the s*n. That's where alot of people are missing the point.

Sky are just associated. Sky is not the s*n however the NOTW is.
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Postby red37 » Thu Sep 06, 2007 9:47 am

Chris Bascombe's response over the reaction to his announcement: (posted up on TLW)

*********************************************

LIVERPOOL likes to describe itself as a radical city, but it isn't.

Conservativism thrives here.

Not the party political right wing stereotype of Thatcherism. This is more an entrenched belief in the permanent righteousness of the past. Preferences and dislikes have been set in an imaginary stone by our unofficial ministers of truth. Their scouse law dictates which city, football clubs, comedians, musicians, politicians and writers are to be loved and hated. It's a mentality which - taken to the extreme - effectively ensures future generations have no free will on a whole range of issues. They must accept what the superscouse superiors say or be damned.

Those who try to challenge this lack of logic or find virtue in change are ridiculed, accused of betrayal or, in some cases, threatened.

I've always thought of myself as of a more liberal mind, and I'd say I belong to a generation of scousers proud of this city's past, aching to see it advance, but more often than not frustrated.

Some of us are fortunate enough to be in a position to try to demand such change, often with very limited success. This brings responsibility, certainly in a job such as the one I'm giving up, but you hope the people who inspired you along the way mean you get more right than wrong.

You get influenced by your heroes and, until a certain age, believe everything they say is right. Mine were Brian Reade, Mrs Fay (my sociology teacher at SFX), Roddy Frame and my parents. They still are.

As you get older, more aware of yourself and the city around you, you finally settle on a set of beliefs which you're comfortable with. The heroic voices become guides from memory rather than the absolute reference points for all knowledge. That's where I am now and have been for many years. Aware enough to hear and understand different points of view, but experienced and intelligent enough to recognise in life, nothing is ever black or white.

Eighteen years ago, my absolute faith in everything 'scouse' was probably embarrassing. To call it parochialism would be generous, but it bordered on regional prejudice. The years have sorted me out, and I can now put much of what I said, did or wrote down to immaturity. Having the good fortune to go to University in Liverpool and later Cornwall College for my post-grad journalism course - where none of my best friends were scousers and some were, shock horror, cockneys and Mancs - brought more wisdom than any books or lectures.

That said, put me in bar down south with a load of cockneys wearing Harry Enfield wigs today (even worse when they wearing Liverpool shirts), and my temperature still makes my face beetroot red. I'm consistently appalled by how our city and its people are misrepresented across the country. Nothing angers me more. That's one of the reasons I became a journalist and it remains the case.

But the rose-tinted spectacles also went a long time ago. The more I've travelled, the more examples I've seen of people who claim to be 'our own' degrading our reputation, and making me want to avoid places where I know the wrong type will be. The 'conservatives' never like to dwell on this, of course.

There are those who insist to magnify our blemishes is an act of treason. Dare to mention the Munich chants at Old Trafford as I did last season, and you're hit with 'what about their Heysel songs?' as if responding to toe-rags by acting like one is a justification. My response to that argument was always the same. It's not my job to investigate the Mancunian psyche. It doesn't embarrass me, my friends or family.

There are times I've lost faith with being a Liverpool lad, but only for a millisecond. I'm swiftly pulled back in by the honesty, generosity and humanity of my friends, family, and hundreds of others I may have only met briefly but whose company is a permanent reminder of where I'm from and why I'll never forget it.

It's those people and the thousands I've never met but I know are out there who I've always considered my audience during my time at the Liverpool ECHO.

The overwhelming majority of people in Liverpool are intelligent; thoughtful; generous of heart and spirit, and of like mind. They just get out-shouted a lot by our mob or out-manoeuvred by the more incompetent of our politicians or civic leaders.

The biggest compliments I've ever enjoyed as an ECHO writer have come from strangers who've said 'you write how I think'.

Now I'm leaving the ECHO, I don't see why such people will feel any differently. I guess it's those people, if they're concerned about where I'm heading next, I'm addressing now.

I've spoken to other sports editors from national newspapers in the past, all of whom asked me how I'd change my approach to the job. The blank, or perhaps it was hostile look, I gave them may explain why offers never materialised.

When the News of the World asked me to write for them, it was made clear they wanted to me to do the same job I've been doing for ten years but even better. That's what I intend to do.

I don't need to justify my decision, but for those peddling falsehoods since the shock news a tabloid football reporter has decided to join another tabloid newspaper, I'll say this. It's not a question of conscience. The News of the World is not The Sun, never has been and never will be. There's never been a Merseyside boycott of the News of the World. Liverpool Football Club has never changed its policy of co-operation with the News of the World.

At Anfield, it's treated the same as every other national newspaper, except one.

I won't be working in an office in London alongside Sun journalists. I'll be working on Merseyside doing my damned hardest to beating them to stories, the same way I've always done.

Will they use my best interviews and exclusives a day after they've appeared in the News of the World? I hope so. They've done so with every ECHO interview and exclusive story in the last ten years, so why should anyone care if that changes now? It will mean my articles are worth stealing. Every paper and website does it, not just The Sun.

The fact The Sun has no Sunday paper does not mean it's The Sun on Sunday, in the same way the The Sunday People has no equivalent daily paper. It's a different paper run by the same organisation, just like The Times, SKY TV and hundreds of other media outlets.

I've been working for the Liverpool ECHO, and no-one's ever said I'm effectively a Daily Post reporter too. These papers are far more connected in terms of commercial crossover and advertising, but I never heard anyone claim the Post is the Morning ECHO, or the ECHO is the Evening Post.

I'm joining a newspaper which is read by around 3 million people a week, which I thought might please those who think there's an anti-Merseyside agenda in the national Press.

Instead of sitting on the sidelines spitting venom at how unjust the treatment of Merseyside is, there's an opportunity to focus on the positives.

The editor is a scouser, the new chief football writer is a scouser, and contrary to ten years of internet lies, so am I.

Of course, the conservatives won't like this. Far better to have something to despise and hate for the next 100 years rather than embrace the possibility of making a newspaper they don't like better in the short-term, even if it's just a miniscule percentage because an unknown local sports reporter has signed up.

To those people (on other sites) who've condemned my decision, issued threats and written lies about my situation, I say thank you. In attempting to damage a reputation without having the decency to check your facts, or approach me for an explanation of my decision, you've behaved like the gutter journalists you claim to be on a moral crusade against.

The difference is, journalists have to put their names and a point of contact behind their allegations rather than hide behind alter-egos or pseudonyms.

You've reinforced the belief I've had from day one that this was the right move because if I'd ever thought I'd worked for you for the last ten years, and owed some weird debt to do so for the next 30, I'd give up on the spot.

For different reasons, I also thank those who've responded on my behalf or jumped to my defence. I hope you'll continue to read my work, but if you don't want to, that's up to you.

Will I look at myself in the mirror with comfort when I start my new job? You can count on it.

Most importantly, the people who are closest to me - friends, family and work colleagues past and future - have all looked me in the eye and told me I'm absolutely doing the right thing. Three of my heroes were the first to congratulate me and tell me I'd earned my opportunity.

The fundamental decency which runs through their core means no-one will convince me otherwise.

**********************************************

Makes a good case against the criticism (much of which was extreme) However, i for one will not be reading any future articles of his.

All the same - best of luck to the fella.
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Postby kunilson » Thu Sep 06, 2007 11:05 am

interesting read that, my opinion hasn't changed since the last post on this matter.....if it did then i shouldn't be posting my "opinion" on anything :;):

but the whole article shows he obviously was hurt by some people's views, and to come out and write it in the first place shows that too....not that im worried about his state of mind but whats done is done now, and theres nothing much left to say on the topic.
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Postby adamnbarrett » Thu Sep 06, 2007 11:41 am

That is obviously a response to the people who've took it too far.

I stand by what I say because I have not issed threats, I have only issued my opinion whichI believe I am entitled to.
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Postby ivor_the_injun » Thu Sep 06, 2007 1:54 pm

Good response. I wondered if he'd tackle the abuse head on, and I'm really pleased that he has. Puts his case across brilliantly, I reckon.
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Postby ConnO'var » Thu Sep 06, 2007 7:19 pm

adamnbarrett wrote:That is obviously a response to the people who've took it too far.

I stand by what I say because I have not issed threats, I have only issued my opinion whichI believe I am entitled to.

Don't defend or apologise for expressing your opinion, Adam. It was not malicious. Neither were anything you said about the organizations involved, untrue.

You ARE entitled to your opinion. Stick to your guns if you feel strongly about it.

It just so happens that I agree with you. I don't like this move of his but I understand his reasons even if I don't agree with his choice.
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Postby NiftyNeil » Thu Sep 06, 2007 8:49 pm

I'm with Mr Barrett. A good response and well put. But I'm standing by what I've said. He has every right to do whatever he wants in life, and maybe I (and others) have been out of order for lambasting his decision - after all, who are we to him? I still won't ever buy a copy of the NOTW though and I still think he's sold out - That's my opinion which I have the right to, just like he has the right to choose where he works.
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Postby lakes10 » Thu Sep 06, 2007 9:03 pm

I dont get all this, NOTW is not the S*n, In fact the last time i was in Liverpool i was in a pub and most seemed to be reading NOTW? ????

Good luck with your now job mate, right some nice stuff about us.
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