Liverpool FC Forum

[NANNY RED]

Enlighten us Saint. Some of us get the game on Sky commentated on by John Helm, and the second the final whisatle goes we're onto Powerboating. At least people can't accuse me of being an Andy Gray disciple.

Question - is it fair to say you looked a more dangerous side when you sent Crouch on.
Rafa - we had Harry Kewell and Gerrard so we had more offensive players on the pitch

Question - Has Crouch done enough to cement a place against Besiktas.
Rafa - we have Voronin who was missing today so we will have more options against Besiktas

(Words to that effect anyway)Rafa interview BBC LINK

Somethings defo going on with crouchy and Rafa

Maybe Abbeys given him the knock back

[Avi Cohen]

Sorry but we have the right players but they are not being told how to play the right way.

[NANNY RED]

Sorry but we have the right players but they are not being told how to play the right way.

So how come weve reached 3 finals with the same man

Or was Pako really the boss

[romliv]

we haven't win since when !! ?

[RUSHIE#9]

Enlighten us Saint. Some of us get the game on Sky commentated on by John Helm, and the second the final whisatle goes we're onto Powerboating. At least people can't accuse me of being an Andy Gray disciple.

Question - is it fair to say you looked a more dangerous side when you sent Crouch on.
Rafa - we had Harry Kewell and Gerrard so we had more offensive players on the pitch

Question - Has Crouch done enough to cement a place against Besiktas.
Rafa - we have Voronin who was missing today so we will have more options against Besiktas

(Words to that effect anyway)

Retracted!

Having watched the interview now the above quotes aren't quite accurate! 

[Penguins]

I'm getting tired of Rafa's love for Kuyt and to a degree Voronin.

Crouch will score twice as many goals if given the same time as he has already proven last season.
Right now the frustarting thing isn't exactly where we are in the league or about winning this year or next year.

it is about building something that looks capable in the future.
And right now I see nothing of the sort. The attacking play is still as awful as it was when Rafa came and he needs to get his priorities straight about footballing skills and hard work and which is trhe most important.
Hard work work means jack all if you can't do what you are supposed to be doing in defense/midfeild or attack

Rafa just refuses to se that it seems... 

[account deleted by request]

Enlighten us Saint. Some of us get the game on Sky commentated on by John Helm, and the second the final whisatle goes we're onto Powerboating. At least people can't accuse me of being an Andy Gray disciple.

Question - is it fair to say you looked a more dangerous side when you sent Crouch on.
Rafa - we had Harry Kewell and Gerrard so we had more offensive players on the pitch

Question - Has Crouch done enough to cement a place against Besiktas.
Rafa - we have Voronin who was missing today so we will have more options against Besiktas

(Words to that effect anyway)

Retracted!

Having watched the interview now the above quotes aren't quite accurate! 

Its tricky doing a word for word quote when you only use one finger to type, but they are near enough mate.

[romliv]

Sorry but we have the right players but they are not being told how to play the right way.

So how come weve reached 3 finals with the same man

Or was Pako really the boss

yes ! was Pako really the first boss 

[Lucky]

I agree Nanny we didn't "deserve" to win though of course we could have in the last fifteen minutes or so. I suppose I'll get accused of being wise after the event, but my suspicion is if we had gone for it a bit earlier (maybe the whole match or is that just me being silly?) then we would have won the game.

The couple of fairly obvious points which came out of it are firstly that if Torres is injured, then Crouch offers significantly the most out of the other three strikers. People can bang on all they like about him not being "good enough for Liverpool" and they may have a point (I don't think so but there you go), but he is certainly a better bet than either Kuyt or Voronin. I have no idea what is at the root of his fallout with the manager (and to think that three weeks ago we had people on here denying there was any such rift), but whatever it is I hope there's a really good reason for not picking him. On the face of it his non selection is utter madness.

The other thing is, and I've been saying this since the Arsenal game, is that maybe we have to re-asses where we are this season. To be brutally honest, I think a sustained title challenge is unlikely in the short term and when push comes to shove, a draw away from home against a team which is currently above us in the league is not a bad result in itself. Those who are saying we wasted a chance to close up on Arsenal and man Utd are of course correct, but in the overall scheme of things it's looking like the first priority is that we get ourselves firmly into the top four.

Spot on, bigmick, but even if our priority adjusted to what you suggested (though I still hope we can challenge for the title this season), we still should expect great improvement of our playing (that's our hope for the future if we are not ready at the moment), but what we have seen now? Similar problems to last season, if not worse.

Should we be much better than last season? With our big spend in the summer, I think we should. At the start of the the season, I thought we were. But right now, I'm really confused and frustrated.

Something has to be got right from our manager, the sooner, the better. Otherwise we were not only losing our title race this season, but also would find ourselves disappointing in next season(s).

[account deleted by request]

I think the return of Kewell will enable us to win more of our home games, he allows our forwards the time to get in the box before making his cross/pass, something we have been missing for a while. I think we will see Gerrard moving back on the right once Kewell is established and Torres is back.

Today we just looked completely void of ideas till Kewell and Crouch came on. Kuyt looked a lot happier playing second striker and it certainly helped Gerrards game.

[JohnBull]

The problems are starting to come from two sides now.

The main problem is Raffa's insistence on the two holding midfielders  and one up front. This is the system that worked so well in Valencia and he's trying to repeat it here. The problem is that you need two good holding players and we've got one, Mascarano.  Sissoko, the same as Sammi, is becoming a liability and no matter how much good work is done by Mascarano, it is undone by Sissoko's awful play. Carra is runnning himself to a standstill covering Sammi's mistakes. We do not have a forward capable of being a lone striker.
We've spent more than enough money to be able to ride the storm of injuries but the purchases made are not up to the job and as long as Raffa persists with this 4-3-2-1 system the more we will be caught out by the shortcomings of the squad.  I don't know if the coaches in La Liga are thicker than those here but the Premiership coaches seem to be able to close down our game plan at will. We must have the narrowest attacking formation I've ever seen.

The second problem I can see is the man himself. Raffa's insistence on not playing some players and playing others who are way off form can only be put down to selfish stubborness. He is putting his position before the good of the team and seems to feel he is bigger than the club. A fault he appeared to attribute to Gerrard recently. You can see that the team are happier playing with Crouch up front and you can see the chances the boy creates. Why doesn't he play him ? There is absolutely no sensible reason in my view.

The coming transfer window will show how much other clubs and managers value Crouch who's treatment this season has been an utter disgrace. I honestly do not know how Raffa can look at the boy in the face when he gives him his regular 15 minutes chance of glory.

"Raffa Out" ?  Sounds dramatic but I can see it coming !

[Listern]

I'm getting fed up of watching overly cautious, boring and lacklustre football
from a manager who is too conservative and a bunch of players who
seem to apathetic to ignore rafa and venture out and play good football.

We should be beating the likes of blackburn, birmingham and portsmouth,
but because of rafa's over complication of football, his lack of adventure,
his refusal to allow attacking players freedom of expression and the fact
he is playing a striker who is not good enough is all aiding to our rut.

boring football i can tolerate providing we are winning matches, but
we aren't winning matches and the football on display is getting hard to
stomach. It's boring as heck and I feel for those fans who pour their hard
earned crust into the club, who go to matches across the globle, who
stand in the wind and rain and yet are let down by a manager who is more
concerned with clean sheets than scoring goals and a bunch of players
who are taking home their money and not contributing their share of the deal.

we have players such a torres and Gerrard who would all thrive with creative freedom
and individuality, as well as the likes of Babel, Benayoun, Kewell, but who are all
made to play under a rigid and compact system where creative freedom is frowned upon.

This I feel is our biggest problem and until the shackles are taken off, then we'll
continue to be toothless in attack. We can sign Eto'o and Kaka next summer and it still
wont make a blind bit of difference to our fortunes.

We have the players to at least challenge, but Rafa isn't getting enough out of the players
and the players aren't getting enough out of Rafa. Today we should have won by a clear margin,
the likes of man u, arsenal and Chelsea will pick up results against blackburn, so why cant we?

we had a chance to close the gap today and we wasted it, its as though the players and rafa were searching for a point and for a club like us, thats not good enough.

[JoeTerp]

considering our current fitness levels I think Arbeloa and Aurelio need to pair up on the left, get Risse out of there, might even want to see Hobbs playing more for Hyypia but not yet. Play Mascher and Lucas in the middle, Gerrard on the Right, Kewell behind the striker and I guess Crouch by default at striker.  I'm not sure what Babel's best position is right now, but I am pretty sure its on the bench.  Kuyt shouldn't even be in the squad, same with Momo (take his name out of the song) we NEEED Torres back badly.

[destro]

Today we should have won by a clear margin,
the likes of man u, arsenal and Chelsea will pick up results against blackburn, so why cant we?

Arsenal and Chelsea have already drawn against Blackburn, other than that good post, sums up what most Liverpool fans are thinking 

[NANNY RED]

The problems are starting to come from two sides now.

The main problem is Raffa's insistence on the two holding midfielders  and one up front. This is the system that worked so well in Valencia and he's trying to repeat it here. The problem is that you need two good holding players and we've got one, Mascarano.  Sissoko, the same as Sammi, is becoming a liability and no matter how much good work is done by Mascarano, it is undone by Sissoko's awful play. Carra is runnning himself to a standstill covering Sammi's mistakes. We do not have a forward capable of being a lone striker.
We've spent more than enough money to be able to ride the storm of injuries but the purchases made are not up to the job and as long as Raffa persists with this 4-3-2-1 system the more we will be caught out by the shortcomings of the squad.  I don't know if the coaches in La Liga are thicker than those here but the Premiership coaches seem to be able to close down our game plan at will. We must have the narrowest attacking formation I've ever seen.

The second problem I can see is the man himself. Raffa's insistence on not playing some players and playing others who are way off form can only be put down to selfish stubborness. He is putting his position before the good of the team and seems to feel he is bigger than the club. A fault he appeared to attribute to Gerrard recently. You can see that the team are happier playing with Crouch up front and you can see the chances the boy creates. Why doesn't he play him ? There is absolutely no sensible reason in my view.

The coming transfer window will show how much other clubs and managers value Crouch who's treatment this season has been an utter disgrace. I honestly do not know how Raffa can look at the boy in the face when he gives him his regular 15 minutes chance of glory.

"Raffa Out" ?  Sounds dramatic but I can see it coming !

Great post Johnbull

Apart from

"Raffa Out" ?  Sounds dramatic but I can see it coming !


IT wont be coming from me as i couldnt even imagine who we would replace him with :