Liverpool FC Forum

[GYBS]

I didnt mention anything about the sack rafa bit or best chance etc etc etc blah blah . It just seems to me every time this thing comes up you mention about othe rteams being weaker etc and it being a poorer prem as there is no arsenal invicible etc etc yet both arsenal and chelsea have the same players bar a few extra additions so as a squad and a team they are no weaker than last season and in fact both strengthened player wise - chelsea under scolari were sweeping everything away in front of them for the first ten odd games - arsenal last season had an indian start - playing way above themselves with lovely football but were alwasy going to come undone when it came to a fight due to lack of expirience and steel - same again as this season - the steel was more apparent early this season as opposed to late last season . Personnell wise they both didnt loose any key outstanding players over the summer - so the weaker prem thing doesnt seem it to me ?

and who is having a pop mick ? im just debating your points thats all - nothing personal dont worry .

[Festy]

Eduardo was fast becoming their key player when they lost him. Hleb and Flamini were key players too. So Arsenal are definitely weaker than last season. Chelsea are no weaker though.

[GYBS]

Eduardo was fast becoming their key player when they lost him. Hleb and Flamini were key players too. So Arsenal are definitely weaker than last season. Chelsea are no weaker though.

I totally forgot about Helb and Flamini so i stand very corrected - eduardo i dont think even started going when he broke his leg and wouldnt get into the team ahead of adebayor and van persie . Did they get nasri during this season or season before ?

[Festy]

I totally forgot about Helb and Flamini so i stand very corrected.

How exactly do you stand "very corrected" in that case ?

[Festy]

Eduardo was fast becoming their key player when they lost him. Hleb and Flamini were key players too. So Arsenal are definitely weaker than last season. Chelsea are no weaker though.

I totally forgot about Helb and Flamini so i stand very corrected - eduardo i dont think even started going when he broke his leg and wouldnt get into the team ahead of adebayor and van persie . Did they get nasri during this season or season before ?

Sorry GYBS, but you have no idea what's going on at Arsenal mate. 

[simolonge]

As for the thing about it being our "last" chance, at least we agree on something as that's a ridiculous notion. If anybody said it was our "last" chance of winning the Premiership then obviously they are an idiot. It was though clearly our "best" chance of many years, as we actually put in a sustained challenge (and indeed still are doing). Much of the fact that it has been our "best' chance for years is and has been been down to our excellence, both of the team and of the manager. Some of the fact that it has been our "best" chance for many a year though is obviously because Arsenal aren't as good as they historically have been, and neither are Chelsea. We can dispute the point until we're blue in the face (or at least you can if you like) but it remains as close to a fact as you can get I should think. Unless of course you truly do think that Arsenal are as good a team as they were last season, or that Chelsea wouldn't have been stronger had Hiddink been there all year. Anyways thats for you to wrestle with as you try and make the various threads of your argument hang together, for my part I'm simply glad we've improved.

Sack Rafa !

We have done well cus Arsenal and Chelsea have been poor ?

Get a grip will yer - we only played them both twice so that is hardly the reason we have done well.

What a strange post. Sack Rafa? Hmmm good one.

I don't know why it is that certain subjects seem to rile people up, but they do. So Arsenal are as strong this season as last when they very nearly won it, and Chelsea wouldn't have been stronger if Hiddink had been there all season? And it's me who needs to get a grip.

On a more serious note, I hope that next season Arsenal and Chelsea are just as good in the league as they have been this time around. My suspicion though is that neither club will be quite as inneffective. Like all things though, the fullness of time will prove or disprove all theories so it'll be interesting to see which way it goes.

Back to the "sack Rafa" bit, I suppose this part of my post which you quoted "Much of the fact that it has been our "best' chance for years is and has been been down to our excellence, both of the team and of the manager" must have been in invisible ink or something. Someone definately needs to get a grip, you're right there.

Correct me if I am wrong, but the jist of your post is that we are only where we are because Arsenal and Chelsea have been poor this season.

[GYBS]

Eduardo was fast becoming their key player when they lost him. Hleb and Flamini were key players too. So Arsenal are definitely weaker than last season. Chelsea are no weaker though.

I totally forgot about Helb and Flamini so i stand very corrected - eduardo i dont think even started going when he broke his leg and wouldnt get into the team ahead of adebayor and van persie . Did they get nasri during this season or season before ?

Sorry GYBS, but you have no idea what's going on at Arsenal mate. 

Amd why exactly is that then festy ? do enlighten me .

So they sold helb and got nasri - direct replacement and didnt replace flamini but brought through diaby and song instead .

[Judge]

So the mancs can lift the league before we even KO.

yes. they only need 4 pts to win the title

maybe 3 at wigan and then a point with arsenal 

[mkingdom]

Sad to say that I can only see Manure winning against both Arsenal and Wigan....Steve Bruce is one of the ex Utd players who aren't allowed to beat their old boss, so he'll be rolling over like a good boy.

Arsenal have gone, and I can see another mauling on the cards for them.

I'll hope for a miracle until the end is confirmed, but just like Saturday, Utd will buy a cheap free kick, and get it deflected off the ball boys ar$e or similar into the top corner to open the scoring. Then the opposition will believe that they should concede a couple more to stop fergie having a tant, and bish bash bosh another 3-0 win.

All of our players need to savour what is likely to be a very unpallatable few weeks watching Utd lift one if not two major trophies, and remember that feeling before every kick off next year.

[Festy]

Sad to say that I can only see Manure winning against both Arsenal and Wigan....Steve Bruce is one of the ex Utd players who aren't allowed to beat their old boss, so he'll be rolling over like a good boy.

Arsenal have gone, and I can see another mauling on the cards for them.

I'll hope for a miracle until the end is confirmed, but just like Saturday, Utd will buy a cheap free kick, and get it deflected off the ball boys ar$e or similar into the top corner to open the scoring. Then the opposition will believe that they should concede a couple more to stop fergie having a tant, and bish bash bosh another 3-0 win.

All of our players need to savour what is likely to be a very unpallatable few weeks watching Utd lift one if not two major trophies, and remember that feeling before every kick off next year.

Good post and agree with everything. And sadly, I can't see Mancscum loosing a game again this season. Teams are showing no balls against them for some reason. 

[aCe']

I didnt mention anything about the sack rafa bit or best chance etc etc etc blah blah . It just seems to me every time this thing comes up you mention about othe rteams being weaker etc and it being a poorer prem as there is no arsenal invicible etc etc yet both arsenal and chelsea have the same players bar a few extra additions so as a squad and a team they are no weaker than last season and in fact both strengthened player wise - chelsea under scolari were sweeping everything away in front of them for the first ten odd games - arsenal last season had an indian start - playing way above themselves with lovely football but were alwasy going to come undone when it came to a fight due to lack of expirience and steel - same again as this season - the steel was more apparent early this season as opposed to late last season . Personnell wise they both didnt loose any key outstanding players over the summer - so the weaker prem thing doesnt seem it to me ?

and who is having a pop mick ? im just debating your points thats all - nothing personal dont worry .chan

Come on now its hard to say that Arsenal and Chelsea have been their normal selves this season ... they've been pretty poor (in patches) and it was mostly because of changes in personnel.. Arsenal missed Flamini, Hleb, Eduardo(injury), Fabregas (injury)... Chelsea suffered from the change in managers, also the loss of Essien, Drogba and Joe Cole to injuries for the better part of this season...

It was a good opportunity, a very good one for an improved Liverpool side to go out and win the league (especially given that we'v beaten Utd and Cheslea twice in the league), too bad we didnt take it, but if its any consolation we came pretty close eventually...  time to build on from here knowing its going to be even harder to win it next time around..

[bunglemark2]

Gotta agree with aCe there....We could've had it wrapped up by now, were it not for the duff performances at home a few months back.
There's no chance it will be as easy next year, and especially not if Rafa succumbs to a ridiculous idea and sells Alonso in particular. Granted he hasn't been as effective in his last few games....maybe that's a sign that he IS on his way out, who knows ? But of all those linked with an exit from the club, he deffo shouldn't be.

[GYBS]

But we have also had dips in form just like them and have had players out through injury just like them mate . We have just played better than them over the season as opposed to them being weaker than previously - ie giving the full credit to our players and managers .

And yes your spot on we need to build on it now .

[Owzat]

Sad to say that I can only see Manure winning against both Arsenal and Wigan....Steve Bruce is one of the ex Utd players who aren't allowed to beat their old boss, so he'll be rolling over like a good boy.

Arsenal have gone, and I can see another mauling on the cards for them.

I'll hope for a miracle until the end is confirmed, but just like Saturday, Utd will buy a cheap free kick, and get it deflected off the ball boys ar$e or similar into the top corner to open the scoring. Then the opposition will believe that they should concede a couple more to stop fergie having a tant, and bish bash bosh another 3-0 win.

All of our players need to savour what is likely to be a very unpallatable few weeks watching Utd lift one if not two major trophies, and remember that feeling before every kick off next year.

Good post and agree with everything. And sadly, I can't see Mancscum loosing a game again this season. Teams are showing no balls against them for some reason. 

They've won seven in a row in the league, a longer winning run than we've managed since 05/06. They got out of jail against villa, slumberland and spudz, but we have too at times this season so can't grumble. Fact is they've kept 22 clean sheets, won 1-0 NINE times and been outstanding at home - except against us and Newcastle.

We simply haven't been able to keep up with their relentlessness, unaccustomed to winning week in, week out the same as they are.

Are we up there because Chelsea and Arsenal have had an 'off season' ? I would say it is contributory, whether our improvement would have taken us past a fully firing Arsenal or Chelsea is hard to say. Chelsea are still on our heels despite us doing the double over them, Arsenal are sat in no-man's land between the top three and the also-rans, safe in 4th with nothing left to play for.

When did we last win 4-1 away to Arsenal? Answer is we haven't in the Premiership, our best win there in the Premiership was 2-1 in 96/97 and we've won there 1-0 four times. Last time I can find we won there 4-1 is the 1922/23 FA Cup from a scan of our results against them.


Arsenal may well drift behind the rest of the 'big four', perhaps be displaced by Citeh if they aren't careful. A reluctance to move with the times and go for big names might cost them Champions League football, that and the prospect of UEFA taking places away if they so choose. I don't think spending big is an option anymore, to assemble a side that costs little but wins league titles is growing increasingly difficult with less prospect of success. I think that is what keeps villa and the bitters at bay, a reluctance come inability to join the big boys. The fact that they can't catch Arsenal and Arsenal can't catch Chelsea just shows the gulf, even though a fair few people think both villa and the bitters had a "good season". (not that some don't say those teams have a "good season" if they finish in the top half)

[Festy]

I didnt mention anything about the sack rafa bit or best chance etc etc etc blah blah . It just seems to me every time this thing comes up you mention about othe rteams being weaker etc and it being a poorer prem as there is no arsenal invicible etc etc yet both arsenal and chelsea have the same players bar a few extra additions so as a squad and a team they are no weaker than last season and in fact both strengthened player wise - chelsea under scolari were sweeping everything away in front of them for the first ten odd games - arsenal last season had an indian start - playing way above themselves with lovely football but were alwasy going to come undone when it came to a fight due to lack of expirience and steel - same again as this season - the steel was more apparent early this season as opposed to late last season . Personnell wise they both didnt loose any key outstanding players over the summer - so the weaker prem thing doesnt seem it to me ?

and who is having a pop mick ? im just debating your points thats all - nothing personal dont worry .chan

Come on now its hard to say that Arsenal and Chelsea have been their normal selves this season ... they've been pretty poor (in patches) and it was mostly because of changes in personnel.. Arsenal missed Flamini, Hleb, Eduardo(injury), Fabregas (injury)... Chelsea suffered from the change in managers, also the loss of Essien, Drogba and Joe Cole to injuries for the better part of this season...

It was a good opportunity, a very good one for an improved Liverpool side to go out and win the league (especially given that we'v beaten Utd and Cheslea twice in the league), too bad we didnt take it, but if its any consolation we came pretty close eventually...  time to build on from here knowing its going to be even harder to win it next time around..

Agree with you aCe. I still remember some very odd moments this season where we hurt ourselves for no apparent reasons. For e.g. the way we set up at Villa park was pathetic, we played like Stoke that day.    Shutting up shop at Emirates against 10 men with more than 20 mins. to go. Substituting our goal threats against Wigan with 10 mins to go at 1-1.