Liverpool FC Forum

[Emerald Red]

You will prob find the majority of people serving in Afghan currently joined up after the 9/11

more made up facts 

Not in the slightest . The fact the average age of a soldier in the army out on afghan is between 22 and 23 you figure out when they joined up .

I don't think that's why they signed up, though, Benny. A few in the aftermath, maybe; but most signed up because of differnent reasons depending where they come from over there. Chances are most signed up because they come from areas where there is a large military presence and needed a job or went for the benefits.

Anyway, this thread's about the witch!

[Benny The Noon]

Yeah your right mate . I think the views on Twa.tcher will always differ depending on where you live and if you are middle class or working class . If you were southern or middle class or both then she looked after you ( as it seems all Tory governments do ) - working class , working in British industry or Northern then she ruined people lives . The poll tax was her nail in the coffin after all the riots .

[Reg]

Yeah your right mate . I think the views on Twa.tcher will always differ depending on where you live and if you are middle class or working class . If you were southern or middle class or both then she looked after you ( as it seems all Tory governments do ) - working class , working in British industry or Northern then she ruined people lives . The poll tax was her nail in the coffin after all the riots .

Feckin' 'ell Benny, you've got a chip on your shoulder. The 'middle class' as you call it is by far the biggest and fastest growing sector of society due to better education, job training and more sophisticated jobs than 25+ years ago. You've got to move with the times and embrace change!

Even I haven't worn my flat cap in bed for at least 20 years.

[Benny The Noon]

Yeah your right mate . I think the views on Twa.tcher will always differ depending on where you live and if you are middle class or working class . If you were southern or middle class or both then she looked after you ( as it seems all Tory governments do ) - working class , working in British industry or Northern then she ruined people lives . The poll tax was her nail in the coffin after all the riots .

Feckin' 'ell Benny, you've got a chip on your shoulder. The 'middle class' as you call it is by far the biggest and fastest growing sector of society due to better education, job training and more sophisticated jobs than 25+ years ago. You've got to move with the times and embrace change!

Even I haven't worn my flat cap in bed for at least 20 years.

She put half my family on the dole Reg . She ruined British Industry - what great things do we build now ? Planes ? Cars ? Boats ? - there nothing British now .

[Big Niall]

Yeah your right mate . I think the views on Twa.tcher will always differ depending on where you live and if you are middle class or working class . If you were southern or middle class or both then she looked after you ( as it seems all Tory governments do ) - working class , working in British industry or Northern then she ruined people lives . The poll tax was her nail in the coffin after all the riots .

Feckin' 'ell Benny, you've got a chip on your shoulder. The 'middle class' as you call it is by far the biggest and fastest growing sector of society due to better education, job training and more sophisticated jobs than 25+ years ago. You've got to move with the times and embrace change!

Even I haven't worn my flat cap in bed for at least 20 years.

She put half my family on the dole Reg . She ruined British Industry - what great things do we build now ? Planes ? Cars ? Boats ? - there nothing British now .

that is true - however most of western europe and the USA are losing their industrial base to china/india/eastern europe.

that isn't maggies fault.

However, I would like to know how the germans are doing it as they still produce stuff.

[tonyeh]

RGB, Churchill didnt benefit from his handling of WW11, he was voted out at the first opportunity!

But Churchill benefited immensely from the war, during the war. It got him elected as PM when he was all but finished. No WWII, no PM for Winnie.

After the war was over, of course, the British voted him out as quick as they could. They recognised, quite correctly that Churchillian hyperbole and bluster was not what the British needed at that time.

But, he got back in in the 50's, largely due to the war nostalgia of the voting public. So, it benefitted him that way too.

Churchill was, by and large, a failure in politics and war for the better part of his public life.

[Reg]

Yep but I think WC would have willingly traded peace for the PM-ship!  He was undoubtedly a rebel who happened to be the best man for tehjob when eth chips were down. I would say he 'benefitted' from the war in a material way, but for sure he made his name.

[7_Kewell]

Yeah your right mate . I think the views on Twa.tcher will always differ depending on where you live and if you are middle class or working class . If you were southern or middle class or both then she looked after you ( as it seems all Tory governments do ) - working class , working in British industry or Northern then she ruined people lives . The poll tax was her nail in the coffin after all the riots .

Feckin' 'ell Benny, you've got a chip on your shoulder. The 'middle class' as you call it is by far the biggest and fastest growing sector of society due to better education, job training and more sophisticated jobs than 25+ years ago. You've got to move with the times and embrace change!

Even I haven't worn my flat cap in bed for at least 20 years.

She put half my family on the dole Reg . She ruined British Industry - what great things do we build now ? Planes ? Cars ? Boats ? - there nothing British now .

Ruined British industry?

I think you'll find it was in ruins before she came to power. The trade unions and Labour finished it off in the 70s. For example, it was cheaper to buy coal and have to imported from Australia that it was to mine the stuff here.

She took a realist view to what mess was left. She didn't ruin it, she put it out of its misery

[tonyeh]

Yep but I think WC would have willingly traded peace for the PM-ship!  He was undoubtedly a rebel who happened to be the best man for tehjob when eth chips were down. I would say he 'benefitted' from the war in a material way, but for sure he made his name.

I'll have to disagree with you there.

To my mind Churchill loved the war and did his best to stay in it throughout.

The war made Churchill and he knew it. Without it, he was nothing. In fact he was worse than nothing. He was remembered as the man who fucked up Gallipoli and ordered soldiers to charge miners in Wales.

He was generally disliked.

[Big Niall]

I'm pleasantly surpised that people can discuss Churchill without leaving the WW2 hero tag putting him beyond criticism.

Good war time leader, bad peace time politican (didn't want women or working class to vote, leaving gold standard failed, sent black and tan thugs into Ireland who committed lots of atrocities,) however he was right re free trade and knew what Hitler and Stalin were about before others (yet made the correct decision of being an ally with a murderous psycho like stalin)

[worcester_red]

A soldiers death in only tragic if the war/battle is pointless, misdirected or unjustified?

Any soldiers death is tragic .

Even an SS Officer running a concentration camp???

[worcester_red]

Yeah your right mate . I think the views on Twa.tcher will always differ depending on where you live and if you are middle class or working class . If you were southern or middle class or both then she looked after you ( as it seems all Tory governments do ) - working class , working in British industry or Northern then she ruined people lives . The poll tax was her nail in the coffin after all the riots .

Feckin' 'ell Benny, you've got a chip on your shoulder. The 'middle class' as you call it is by far the biggest and fastest growing sector of society due to better education, job training and more sophisticated jobs than 25+ years ago. You've got to move with the times and embrace change!

Even I haven't worn my flat cap in bed for at least 20 years.

She put half my family on the dole Reg . She ruined British Industry - what great things do we build now ? Planes ? Cars ? Boats ? - there nothing British now .

Are you suggesting British Leyland ever made anything great?? 

[worcester_red]

RGB, Churchill didnt benefit from his handling of WW11, he was voted out at the first opportunity!

But Churchill benefited immensely from the war, during the war. It got him elected as PM when he was all but finished. No WWII, no PM for Winnie.

After the war was over, of course, the British voted him out as quick as they could. They recognised, quite correctly that Churchillian hyperbole and bluster was not what the British needed at that time.

But, he got back in in the 50's, largely due to the war nostalgia of the voting public. So, it benefitted him that way too.

Churchill was, by and large, a failure in politics and war for the better part of his public life.

Churchill a failure in War, wow well I guess that is one way to look at it but I suspect you'll find that is the minority view!!!

[tonyeh]

RGB, Churchill didnt benefit from his handling of WW11, he was voted out at the first opportunity!

But Churchill benefited immensely from the war, during the war. It got him elected as PM when he was all but finished. No WWII, no PM for Winnie.

After the war was over, of course, the British voted him out as quick as they could. They recognised, quite correctly that Churchillian hyperbole and bluster was not what the British needed at that time.

But, he got back in in the 50's, largely due to the war nostalgia of the voting public. So, it benefitted him that way too.

Churchill was, by and large, a failure in politics and war for the better part of his public life.

Churchill a failure in War, wow well I guess that is one way to look at it but I suspect you'll find that is the minority view!!!

Hmmm, you didn't the post very carefully did you?

BTW, I suggest you read up on Churchill before he was made PM in 1940.

[laza]

I'll have to disagree with you there.

To my mind Churchill loved the war and did his best to stay in it throughout.

The war made Churchill and he knew it. Without it, he was nothing. In fact he was worse than nothing. He was remembered as the man who fucked up Gallipoli and ordered soldiers to charge miners in Wales.

He was generally disliked.

Spot on there Tony

Totally off track but it would have been very interesting if Churchill had gone through with his plan fight with the Finns against the Soviets in 1940 as well