Liverpool FC Forum

[shanks72]

But alcohol doesn't wonder over to the table nextdoor and harm you.

No, but the person thats been drinking it does. Ask any policeman, ambulance worker or A&E nurse which they prefer dealing with, someone who's had 10 cigs or someone who's had 10 pints. Ask all the wifes and kids who's husbands and fathers come home drunk and violent. All the people who's lives have been shattered by drink drivers etc etc.

Maybe I'm just "bitter" cos I can't drink anymore

Yes but that's the extreme scenario of what can happen when people are inebriated. Alcohol in moderation in a pub is not harmful to others, smoking is.

You could say if you drank too much orange squash and became hyper that you may also be a risk on the road!

The problem is there are too many people not drinking in moderation and causing problems.

So lets ban alcohol and ban Orange juice. Lets ban cars as well because they cause deaths and injury every day. Ban planes because they are a major cause of global warming.

Or maybe just pick on smokers cos they are an easy target.

First they came for the Communists,
and I didnt speak up,
because I wasnt a Communist.
Then they came for the Jews,
and I didnt speak up,
because I wasnt a Jew.
Then they came for the Catholics,
and I didnt speak up,
because I was a Protestant.
Then they came for me,
and by that time there was no one
left to speak up for me.

They're all separate issues, deal with drunkenness on its own.

Smoking harms people passively, in moderation alcohol does not. Smoking around people is irresponsible in my view and disrespectful, why should non-smokers be harmed by someones else's dirty habit. It's about compromise, the compromise on the part of smokers is to go outside for a quick fag, the compromise for non-smokers is to go to a different pub in a different area. I don't see how the compromise for smokers is so radical?

Is it really so hard to go outside, or go into the beer garden to smoke?

I think that's a reasonable compromise, workers have to be protected aswell - that is one of the MAIN reasons for this ban.

Quite right... 

Actually, I don't think you smokers have a case at all.. 

[dawson99]

denis leary says it best:

Denis Leary: We tried to be nice to you non-smokers. We tried. OK? You wanted your own sections in the restaurants. We gave you that, huh. But that wasn't enough for you. Then you wanted the airplanes. We gave you the whole godamn plane! You happy now? I will guarantee you if the plane is going down, the first announcement you're gonna hear is: "Folks, this is your Captain speaking. Look, uhm, light 'em up, 'cause we're going down, okay. I got a carton of Camel non-filters, I'll see you on the ground."


Denis Leary: Smoking takes ten years off your life. Well it's the ten worst years, isn't it folks? It's the ones at the end! It's the wheelchair, kidney dialysis, adult diaper years. You can have those years! We don't want 'em, alright?


Denis Leary: I'm gonna open up my own place. Open my own restaurant and get away from you people. I'm gonna open up a restaurant with two smoking sections; Ultra and Regular, OK! And we're not gonna have any tables or any chairs or any napkins. None of that pussy sh!t.

and the very best one:

Denis Leary: Happiness comes in small doses folks. It's a cigarette butt, or a chocolate chip cookie or a five second orgasm. You come, you smoke the butt you eat the cookie you go to sleep wake up and go back to f*cking work the next morning, THAT'S IT! End of f*cking list!   

[LFC2007]

but why not have a smoking pub and a non smoking pub? let the people decide democratically, not a bunch or ar$es in suits in westminster.

this country has severely gone to the $hit the last few years. we need a world war or something to bring the people together.

Because in some places that means workers are forced to move just to suit the needs of a dirty habit.

In rural areas what do people do if that pub becomes smoking only?

Do they drive 50+ miles to a non-smoking pub?

In some areas such as in the north east, most of the pubs in rural areas would be smoking only, where are the rights of those individuals who want to go to their local in a smoke free environment?

Do they have to move to London just to find a pub/restaurant that is non-smoking?


Should barworkers and waiters have to move just to suit the needs of the smoker?

[account deleted by request]

Smoking a couple of cigs a day is actually good for you, it helps to prevent Alzheimer's disease, ulcerative colitis, Parkinson's disease and sleep apnea. We are giving you medical treatment and not even charging you!

So just say thank you.

If you don't believe me just check any medical journal.

[dawson99]

yes thats why they are bar waiters!!!! they dont have to do the job. its like in the army when the soldiers sue as they had to go to war, what the f*ck is that all about? We live in a world of suing idiots.

[LFC2007]

That is absolute rubbish to say the least.

Smoking is not good for you in any way shape or form, it is a killer.

[LFC2007]

yes thats why they are bar waiters!!!! they dont have to do the job. its like in the army when the soldiers sue as they had to go to war, what the f*ck is that all about? We live in a world of suing idiots.

They don't have to, but why should smokers FORCE them to move out of an area to find a non-smoking pub. Why should smokers FORCE barmen/waiters into other jobs.

That compromise is far more extreme and it is unfair, where are their RIGHTS?

Is it really so hard to go outside to smoke?

[dawson99]

we dont force them., they chose to work in a place where they fricking knew there would be smoke. if they dont like then they are in the wrong job my friend.

[account deleted by request]

SMOKERS HAVE REDUCED RISKS OF ALZHEIMER'S AND PARKINSON'S DISEASE Patients with Alzheimer's disease (AD) have a considerably decreased life expectancy, with the entire course of the disease taking an average of about eight years. AD is defined by a specific combination of neuropathologic features that include neuronal loss in particular regions of the brain and a high density of senile plaques and neurofibrillary tangles. It is hard to distinguish during life because of other damage and dementias. As many as 80% of the cases may be unrecognized by general practitioners.
Acute administration of low doses of nicotine improved mental processes and may be protective in AD. This possibility was first put forward by Appel, who noted that only 6 out of 30 patients had smoked at any time in their lives. Since that time, nineteen case control studies have been published and are considered here. The overall from these showed a clear negative association, 15 out of 18 studies reporting a lower risk of AD in men and women who had smoked.

Of the 19 studies, 15 found a reduce risk in smokers, and none found an increased risk. And smoking is clearly associated with a reduced risk of Parkinson's disease, another disease in which nicotine receptors are reduced. The fact that acute administration of nicotine improves attention and information processing in AD patients adds further plausibility to the hypothesis.

NEW YORK (Reuters Health) - A new study adds to the previously reported evidence that cigarette smoking protects against Parkinson's disease. Specifically, the new research shows a temporal relationship between smoking and reduced risk of Parkinson's disease. That is, the protective effect wanes after smokers quit.

"It is not our intent to promote smoking as a protective measure against Parkinson's disease," Evan L. Thacker from Harvard School of Public Health emphasized in comments to Reuters Health. "Obviously smoking has a multitude of negative consequences. Rather, we did this study to try to encourage other scientists...to consider the possibility that neuroprotective chemicals may be present in tobacco leaves."

As reported in the March 6th issue of Neurology, Thacker and colleagues analyzed data, including detailed lifetime smoking histories, from 79,977 women and 63,348 men participating in the Cancer Prevention Study II Nutrition Cohort. During about 9 years of follow-up, 413 subjects developed definite or probable Parkinson's

Try looking the rest up yourself

[LFC2007]

Smoking a couple of cigs a day is actually good for you, it helps to prevent Alzheimer's disease, ulcerative colitis, Parkinson's disease and sleep apnea. We are giving you medical treatment and not even charging you!

So just say thank you.

If you don't believe me just check any medical journal.

Ncotine can be obtained in other forms, healthy forms.

It may (and that is a big may) reduce x disease, but it is harming you a billion times more in so many more ways.

[account deleted by request]

So is breathing in car fumes, drinking alcohol, eating sugar, sitting at a computer screen etc etc

[LFC2007]

we dont force them., they chose to work in a place where they fricking knew there would be smoke. if they dont like then they are in the wrong job my friend.

They dirty habit of smoking should not force them ino another job purely because smokers can't be fecked to go outside to smoke.

The balance is wrong, the balance should unquestionably be in favour of protecting the individual. They should not have to suffer the physical effects due to someone else's intolerance.

[LFC2007]

So is breathing in car fumes, drinking alcohol, eating sugar, sitting at a computer screen etc etc

Here's the point you are missing IMO.

Smoking harms you full stop, it harms in moderation, it harms you. Doses of nicotine received from it may reduce other diseases, but the harm it does is unbelieveable. There are 50+++++diseases that are obtainable by smoking.

Drinking in moderation does NOT.

Sitting at a computer screen in moderation does NOT.

Eating sugar in moderation does NOT.

[account deleted by request]

So why should I have to put up with your dirty car fumes. Ban all cars as I cant get away from the evil effects of car fumes.

[shanks72]

Smoking a couple of cigs a day is actually good for you, it helps to prevent Alzheimer's disease, ulcerative colitis, Parkinson's disease and sleep apnea. We are giving you medical treatment and not even charging you!

So just say thank you.

If you don't believe me just check any medical journal.

Hiya saint... 

I don't know what medical journal you read.. anyway I'm not gonna go there...

Just to say I've read that of all the things you could take into your body (no witty replies please!)...smoking is the worst.

Apparently it damages the lungs by restricting the amount of oxygen that can be absorbed.

It is all of no consolation to the woman I used to work with whose husband told me suffered extremely before she died.

It's tragic...for as it appears her death was caused by smoking..then it could so easily have been avoided.