Liverpool FC Forum

by **drummerphil** » Tue Jan 10, 2006 12:06 am

He was watched 3 times i know of by Phil thompson and Sammy Lee........2 years back......but nothing came of it...........he was valued around £750,000 - £850,000 at the time.

by **drummerphil** » Tue Jan 10, 2006 12:08 am

big mistake too.........i may add

by **A.B.** » Tue Jan 10, 2006 12:08 am

He did look alright in the Prem last season, I'll give you that, but I'd have reservations about him making the leap to a top 6 club. Much like a Kevin Phillips, Rob Earnshaw or Andy Johnson - he smells a bit to me like one of those players that's destined to be a big fish in a small pond. It'll take not far short of Crouch-style money to move him on, and I don't think you'll get the player you were expecting.

The same way Crouch smelled like a player destined to be a big pish in a small pond[Soton] until we bought him?

by **JBG** » Tue Jan 10, 2006 12:10 am

drummerphil wrote:He was watched 3 times i know of by Phil thompson and Sammy Lee........2 years back......but nothing came of it...........he was valued around £750,000 - £850,000 at the time.

If we wanted him then, we would have got him ahead of any other club, Chelsea, Arsenal and UTD included, because of our relationship with Crewe at the time.

by **115-1073096938** » Tue Jan 10, 2006 12:11 am

I think you're completely nutz then mate.

I've seen Ashton live and played against him, the lads unbelievable. He was the sole reason Crewe were a mid table side and not relegation fodder, he nearly single handedly kept Norwich up and he's scoring there goals again this year and they've been rubbish.

He has decent pace, a superb touch, is oustanding with his back to goal and extremely strong, very skilfull, always has time on the ball and infront of goal he's lethal. His touch and technique are also superb. I really am not overating the lad. If anything i'm underating him, he's one of the best forwards in the country.

by **drummerphil** » Tue Jan 10, 2006 12:12 am

JBG wrote:
drummerphil wrote:He was watched 3 times i know of by Phil thompson and Sammy Lee........2 years back......but nothing came of it...........he was valued around £750,000 - £850,000 at the time.

If we wanted him then, we would have got him ahead of any other club, Chelsea, Arsenal and UTD included, because of our relationship with Crewe at the time.

that tells you something dosnt it..........that Houllier didnt sign proper players only players with limited talent and way overpriced..............it was a crime they didnt sign Ashton.

by **ivor_the_injun** » Tue Jan 10, 2006 12:14 am

A.B. wrote:
He did look alright in the Prem last season, I'll give you that, but I'd have reservations about him making the leap to a top 6 club. Much like a Kevin Phillips, Rob Earnshaw or Andy Johnson - he smells a bit to me like one of those players that's destined to be a big fish in a small pond. It'll take not far short of Crouch-style money to move him on, and I don't think you'll get the player you were expecting.

The same way Crouch smelled like a player destined to be a big pish in a small pond[Soton] until we bought him?

Go back over some old threads mate - I was one of the rare f*ckers that backed his signing. :rasp

by **drummerphil** » Tue Jan 10, 2006 12:17 am

ivor_the_injun wrote:
A.B. wrote:
He did look alright in the Prem last season, I'll give you that, but I'd have reservations about him making the leap to a top 6 club. Much like a Kevin Phillips, Rob Earnshaw or Andy Johnson - he smells a bit to me like one of those players that's destined to be a big fish in a small pond. It'll take not far short of Crouch-style money to move him on, and I don't think you'll get the player you were expecting.

The same way Crouch smelled like a player destined to be a big pish in a small pond[Soton] until we bought him?

Go back over some old threads mate - I was one of the rare f*ckers that backed his signing.

i can back him up there.........i certainly didnt..........the words.......sh!t ...lanky....and streak of p!ss........came to mind........but i cant eat those words,so will settle for humble pie............but ASHTON.......now there is a player :laugh:

by **115-1073096938** » Tue Jan 10, 2006 12:21 am

ivor_the_injun wrote:My missus' family live in Norfolk, and I've been dragged to see Norwich a couple of times this season. I know that the Norwich fans rate Ashton very highly (£15m or he stays put, according to a couple of local yokels), but although he was clearly a class act in the surroundings, it's clear just from looking at the spacing of the defences exactly how much of a gulf there is from the Prem downwards.

One things for sure, he gets a lot more time and space in the Championship than he'll have in the Prem. I saw him against Millwall, who you'd expect to be on him like a shot, but he had so much time to pick out a pass - even the likes of Birmingham and West Brom would've snuffed out some of his opportunities in a fraction of the time. I really do think he's being flattered by a poor league at the moment. Defenders just backing off and backing off - it was actually quite comical to watch. On one occasion he almost walked with the ball unchallenged from halfway line to the edge of the box before a challenge came in.

He did look alright in the Prem last season, I'll give you that, but I'd have reservations about him making the leap to a top 6 club. Much like a Kevin Phillips, Rob Earnshaw or Andy Johnson - he smells a bit to me like one of those players that's destined to be a big fish in a small pond. It'll take not far short of Crouch-style money to move him on, and I don't think you'll get the player you were expecting.

Can't agree at all. Not in the slightest, i know a player when i see one and that boys a bloody good one.

Thats how you spot a player who's got the ability to make the step up. You were saying he had time on the ball, thats the first thing you look for when you're deciding if a player has the ability to step up a level.

The thing is, i remember watching him at Old Trafford last year and he had acres on the ball that day and scored a class header. He was the best player on the pitch bar none... think about who plays for United aswell...

On the occassion i played against him he was 10 times above everything on the pitch, just the way he shapes himself, touches the ball passes it off. His movement and touches were unreal and to be fair no-one on the pitch got near him once, he played about 35 mins scored a header, a volley from about yards with his left foot and set the winner up with a superb pass.

As for Phillips he's another one who HAD the class. At the time the lad was a superb alround player and for two years would have walked into most premiership teams, infact during his years in the first division he was good enough for the prem. He rotted in a bad side then frittered away to averageness once he reached his early 30's which is a shame as he had the ability to do far more.

Johnson and Earnshaw aren't even nearly in the same class as either of the other two and its an insult to players like Phillips and Ashton to be mentioned in the same breath as them as far as i'm concerned.

by **ivor_the_injun** » Tue Jan 10, 2006 12:24 am

stu_the_red wrote:I think you're completely nutz then mate.

...

He has decent pace, a superb touch, is oustanding with his back to goal and extremely strong, very skilfull, always has time on the ball and infront of goal he's lethal. His touch and technique are also superb. I really am not overating the lad. If anything i'm underating him, he's one of the best forwards in the country.

He's playing in a very poor division. The top three are Reading, Sheff Utd and Leeds FFS. I've seen all three of these play lately and they are no great shakes.

You honestly cannot say that he's one of the best forwards in the country based on the opposition that are put in front of him. It'd be like putting Heskey up against Birmingham Ladies.

He's one of the better players in the Championship, but - you know what - there aren't too many players in the Championship worth having. He may be one of them, but I don't think he's for us. And I don't think he'll end up being better than Cisse.

by **115-1073096938** » Tue Jan 10, 2006 12:25 am

ivor_the_injun wrote:
A.B. wrote:
He did look alright in the Prem last season, I'll give you that, but I'd have reservations about him making the leap to a top 6 club. Much like a Kevin Phillips, Rob Earnshaw or Andy Johnson - he smells a bit to me like one of those players that's destined to be a big fish in a small pond. It'll take not far short of Crouch-style money to move him on, and I don't think you'll get the player you were expecting.

The same way Crouch smelled like a player destined to be a big pish in a small pond[Soton] until we bought him?

Go back over some old threads mate - I was one of the rare f*ckers that backed his signing.

Look again at that and quote what i said...

Along the lines of him being a good player...

I didn't see how he'd fit in and i didn't realise he'd help get that bit more out of Gerrard, i did however see the lad was a good player. I see the same with Ashton being a good player, the thing is, he's better than Crouch infront of goal and i think you'd get just as much if not slightly more in terms of build up as he's strong, his touch and passing is just as good and he has an extra yard of pace. Granted he doesn't have Crouchie's vision or height.

by **ivor_the_injun** » Tue Jan 10, 2006 12:28 am

stu_the_red wrote:
Thats how you spot a player who's got the ability to make the step up. You were saying he had time on the ball, thats the first thing you look for when you're deciding if a player has the ability to step up a level.

There weren't too many players on the pitch that didn't get 10 seconds on the ball unchallenged. Sure, he was picking out good passes and his touch is very good. It's a very different kettle of fish when you've got good Premiership defenders on your chuff though.

by **JBG** » Tue Jan 10, 2006 12:29 am

ivor_the_injun wrote:
stu_the_red wrote:
Thats how you spot a player who's got the ability to make the step up. You were saying he had time on the ball, thats the first thing you look for when you're deciding if a player has the ability to step up a level.

There weren't too many players on the pitch that didn't get 10 seconds on the ball unchallenged. Sure, he was picking out good passes and his touch is very good. It's a very different kettle of fish when you've got good Premiership defenders on your chuff though.

He did very well in a poor team last year in the Premiership.

by **115-1073096938** » Tue Jan 10, 2006 12:31 am

ivor_the_injun wrote:
stu_the_red wrote:I think you're completely nutz then mate.

...

He has decent pace, a superb touch, is oustanding with his back to goal and extremely strong, very skilfull, always has time on the ball and infront of goal he's lethal. His touch and technique are also superb. I really am not overating the lad. If anything i'm underating him, he's one of the best forwards in the country.

He's playing in a very poor division. The top three are Reading, Sheff Utd and Leeds FFS. I've seen all three of these play lately and they are no great shakes.

You honestly cannot say that he's one of the best forwards in the country based on the opposition that are put in front of him. It'd be like putting Heskey up against Birmingham Ladies.

He's one of the better players in the Championship, but - you know what - there aren't too many players in the Championship worth having. He may be one of them, but I don't think he's for us. And I don't think he'll end up being better than Cisse.

I think you are incredibley short sighted then mate. I'm sorry, i'm not looking for an arguement, you've made some good posts and i intend to keep this civil but i just thing you are simply wrong.

He's an outstanding player in a poor league.

He has ability in all area's, Cisse doesn't... Infact its shown all the time, Cisse was put through the other day and hit the ball 15 yards infront of him and the keeper easily collected, i'm sorry mate, thats not a player.

He's never got a second on the ball, his link up and passing is woeful and he has no vision. The lad doesn't see the game properly and simply isn't a good player.

Also, i'm not basing it on the opposition infront of him, i'm basing it simply on his ability and what he's shown in the past. His level's of ability in many area's are excellent. Having seen the lad first hand and playing on the same pitch as him i have a good idea of exactly how good he is.

I used to play against Welshy as a kid occassionally, he was a damn good player, i've seen some lads who are superb players, both pro, semi-pro and amatuer, he's by a mile the bets of the lot in every area.

by **115-1073096938** » Tue Jan 10, 2006 12:33 am

ivor_the_injun wrote:
stu_the_red wrote:
Thats how you spot a player who's got the ability to make the step up. You were saying he had time on the ball, thats the first thing you look for when you're deciding if a player has the ability to step up a level.

There weren't too many players on the pitch that didn't get 10 seconds on the ball unchallenged. Sure, he was picking out good passes and his touch is very good. It's a very different kettle of fish when you've got good Premiership defenders on your chuff though.

The point is he done it in every premiership game last year with the likes of Hyypia, Ferdinand, Terry, Gallas etc on your back, what more can he do?

The lads not a good player, he's no Crouch, Riise or Finnan. He's a class player with class attributes in many area's and a very solid alround game, something Cisse can only ever dream of having.

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